thadec

Please no comparisons to Pat Mahomes with guys who lack his baseball pitcher arm and above average mobility. Jayden Daniels has the latter but not the former.

"McCarthy had the best offensive line in football for the past two seasons" There is a lot of evidence that the UGA 2022 line was better "played schedules weaker than any contender’s I have ever seen" This is objectively not true. Michigan played #2 Washington, #4 Alabama (I do not acknowledge UGA being ranked over them), #10 Ohio State (who would have finished ranked a lot higher had they cared about the Cotton Bowl half as much as Missouri did), #13 Penn State, #24 Iowa plus bowl teams Maryland, Rutgers, Minnesota. The playoff should have ended the "they didn't play anybody" nonsense because there were some national titles where the teams didn't play two top 5 teams in a whole season, let alone in back-to-back weeks. Case in point: USC in 2003 comes to mind; not only was 10-3 Michigan their best win, but they actually lost to 8-6 Cal that year. "and had the best rb duo in the country" You have a WAY higher opinion of Donovan Edwards' 497 rushing yards and 5 TDs at 4.2 ypc in 15 games than you should. The Texas Longhorn trio - Jonathan Brooks, CJ Baxter, Jaydon Blue - were way more explosive. They just didn't have the benefit of the nation's #1 scoring defense (10.4 points a game, and recall that the far more hyped as historic UGA 2021 defense racked up 10.2 points per game). There are good reasons why McCarthy isn't in the same class as Jayden Daniels as a college player - though we should acknowledge that the pro game is far more favorable towards traditional pocket passers than spread RPO passers - but you didn't list any of them.

For DC, Kelly needs a top recruiter as much as - or even slightly more than - a top coach.

A raise and a "co-DC" title is generally what gets it done.

Jesse Minter: while your Tigers have more rings, Michigan is still a more prestigious job in the profession than LSU. Manny Diaz: you can't mean the just-hired HC of Duke right? Blake Baker and (especially) Phil Parker: great at Xs and Os, but looking at Kelly's recruiting classes at LSU (and ND), you Tigers needs another Kirby Smart or Charlie Strong, someone who is both an elite recruiter and DC. Note: Strong is now an "analyst" at Bama, and having blown his shot at the big time (Texas) and also being 63, isn't going to be sought after for a HC job the way that, well, basically every other guy on your list would be. Just a thought.

The UGA pair who posted prior, LeghumperU and TDOWTheGreat, are interesting. The incidents for which Salter was kicked out of the University of Tennessee - marijuana possession; assault (but not battery mind you which is way more serious) and burglary (again, not theft which is more serious) - were misdemeanors. Is it your position that he should have never been able to play major college football again? If so, is that a standard that only applies to college football players? Because if so a lot of places - Hollywood, Washington D.C., Wall Street - wouldn't be able to meet that standard. Or if your issue is his association with the Vols ... that is even stranger. Looks like to me that Heupel cut ties with an extremely talented QB prospect over stuff that gets overlooked at most big time colleges. It wasn't just a matter of a big time athlete putting up major numbers against small college competition. Salter is much better than Malik Willis, the Auburn kid who was last at Liberty under Hugh Freeze and became an NFL draft pick. If Heupel lets this kid stick around, the Vols probably win 11 or 12 games this year with a guy who can actually make the short and intermediate throws that the "I should have given being a baseball pitcher more thought" that Joe Milton never could.

Yes, and the most outstanding player in the regular season was Michael Penix, Jr. Where Penix Jr. led his team to the Pac-12 title and playoff, Jayden Daniels was the #6 team in the SEC. Where Daniels' best win this season was against Missouri because they got humiliated by Alabama and FSU and also lost to Ole Miss, Penix Jr. beat the #3 guy in the Heisman race, Bo Nix, TWICE. Penix Jr. also led the NCAA in passing yards per game for 2 years in a row. The Heisman voters did same nonsense they always do, which is give the award to "spread QB who puts up crazy numbers thanks to a good supporting cast on offense and a bad defense." Tim Tebow, Lamar Jackson and those Big 12 all over again. Scratch that ... at least RG3, Baker Mayfield and those other Big 12 QBs won conference titles. LSU on the other hand was #3 in the SEC West.

Look at Michael Penix Jr's stats (#1 in pass yards per game in 2022 and 2023) and record (11-2 in 2022, 14-0 in 2023) and try that "one game" thing again. Caleb Williams winning the Heisman over Penix Jr. in 2022 was a sick joke. And their giving it to the QB of the #6 team in the SEC over Penix Jr. this year was even worse.

Nah, Gator fans. I remember all last year you guys claimed that Anthony Richardson was the problem, and that if you had a "true quarterback" who could line up under center, drop back, read defenses, make all the throws with touch and accuracy, be a leader etc. it would solve all the Gators' problems. Well Gator fans you got your wish. That talk contributed to Richardson leaving early for the NFL and you have your pro-style pocket passer to replace him. According to you Gator fans, things like suspect supporting casts and playcalling ... that doesn't matter. Get yourself a pocket QB and you are guaranteed to win 10-12 games. The Utah thing was a setback, as was the bowl game before it but don't give up. This is what you wanted so stick with your convictions. Mertz is going to lead you guys to a 10 or 11 game season including an upset of either Tennessee or UGA! No need to ALL OF A SUDDEN discover that there are issues with the talent level, playcalling and strategy when you spent all last season blaming Richardson for everything. Mertz is the guy you wanted - or at least someone like him - so back him and the team 100%.

One of these is not like the others. Ricky Williams had an 11 year career where he rushed for 10,000 yards and 66 TDs, including five 1000 yard seasons and a Pro Bowl/All-Pro season. And this was back when NFL teams used to actually run the ball, meaning that his stats today would have had him in 6 Pro Bowls. Borderline Pro Football Hall of Fame numbers. (Indeed there are RBs in the HoF with less than 10,000 yards.) The only reason why he isn't in the NFL Hall of Fame is because of issues staying healthy: he only started more than 10 games in a season like 4 times. Plus Miami running him 800 times in two seasons on a team with no passing game during the brief part of his career when he was consistently healthy wound up shortening it. Beyond injury issues - some of which were due to overuse - Williams had two problems. The first was Mike Ditka trading all of his picks to get him. Not Williams' fault, but it caused him to enter the NFL with a stigma that he never lived down. (Also, the picks lost in that draft kept the Saints from building an actual team around him. And Ditka wasting even more of the picks that he had left on bad players didn't help matters.) The second was hiring a VERY inexperienced agent who negotiated the worst contract in pro sports history. Seriously. It was an incentive-based contract where only the minimum salary was guaranteed. Yes had Williams reached the incentives the payout would have been huge - one of the biggest in history in fact - BUT WILLIAMS WOULD HAVE HAD TO BREAK THE NFL CAREER RUSHING RECORD TO REACH ALL THE INCENTIVES. And in any year that he didn't reach the extremely high incentive threshold? League minimum. Williams went into a funk - possibly a literal depression - over that contract and then had to fight to force his way out of New Orleans to sign a better one. By that time half his career earning potential was gone and he never got that money back. But yes, his contract dispute and the tactics that he used to get out of New Orleans harmed his reputation too (the media was a good bit more hostile to athletes that weren't quarterbacks or Michael Jordan back then). So yeah, Ricky Williams doesn't belong on a list that includes Ryan Leaf. Not even close.

Mullen had this horrible "strategy" where he refused to fight against UGA, Alabama, Clemson etc. for recruits. He signed plenty of 4 star guys that the big time programs didn't want. After a year or three it was obvious WHY programs that were actually putting work into evaluating prospects didn't want those guys. Mullen won plenty of games with McElwain's recruits, but when his own guys started playing the wheels fell off. The same thing happened at Mississippi State. Sly Croom was a great recruiter but a mediocre coach. Most of the guys that Mullen put in the NFL were kids that Croom recruited. When his own recruits started playing, the Bulldogs sank into mediocrity, save a couple of good years with Dak Prescott. That being said, I don't blame the Gators for giving Mullen a shot. To be fair, pretty much all the Gator hires post Spurrier except Ron Zook were all good on paper. It is just amazing that the only one to actually pan out was Meyer, and even he didn't do much when he ran out of Zook's recruits and couldn't maintain his initial success.

1. Yes. 2. And Mullen didn't have to deal with NIL 3. Mullen also didn't have to deal with UGA winning 2 national titles 4. Mullen didn't have to deal with an SEC East that was on the rebound (top 10 Tennessee plus South Carolina) 5. Mullen also didn't have to deal with Auburn hiring a coach that actually cared about recruiting and building a competent staff 6. Mullen didn't have to deal with an FSU that is winning again or a Miami that is ... well see Auburn Mullen had an ideal window to build a contender and blew it. If Napier succeeds, it will be in a much tougher environment to do so.

For Alabama fans to claim Hurts now is a fraud. During his year at Oklahoma, those same fans were claiming "great story, great person, but not a QB ... his stats are only due to bad Big 12 defenses." Then after it was clear that he was a Heisman candidate they began bashing him because they were afraid that he would take away votes from Tua. It went overtime when Bama lost a game because they were afraid that OU would take their playoff spot. After Oklahoma lost in the playoff their response? "Still a fraud. Still can't make the plays that he couldn't in Tuscaloosa." If you think that they started backing the kid once he was a 2nd round pick in Philadelphia ... you are wrong. They thought the Eagles' taking Hurts as a QB was absurd. They spent 2020 and 2021 cheering (and making excuses for) Tua and Mac Jones, not Hurts. Even down the stretch in 2021 as he led the Eagles into the playoffs they were predicting big things for Tua and Mac while being "whatevs ... he will wash out and be replaced in 2 years like all the rest" with Hurts. Going into this season it was all about how Mac Jones was going to build on his rookie season and the great things that the new coach plus Tyreek Hill and Jaylen Waddle were going to do for Tua. It was only the combination of Hurts' MVP caliber season (though granted, overshadowed by Mahomes' historic one WITHOUT HILL, similar to how Burrow did the same for the 2019 Heisman) plus Tua getting hurt and the rails coming off for Mac Jones did the folks in Tuscaloosa all of a sudden come to the realization "Hurts is our guy and has been all along!" This was the first time anyone has mentioned "Hurts has a Bama degree!" Not a peep was made about this fact while he was on campus. It certainly wasn't said when the folks in Tuscaloosa were resentful and fearful that he and OU were going to take the Heisman and playoff spot from Tua and Bama (when they REALLY should have been playing closer attention to LSU and Burrow with that). But here is the proof: all of these #BuiltByBama types ... ask them if they believe that Hurts should have been given another shot to win his job back. Ask them if Saban should have gone with Hurts during the second half of the 2018 title game debacle with Clemson. That is when the truth will come out. That is when you will find out that these folks aren't actual Hurts fans. They are just bandwagon riders.

No, Jalen Hurts was a Heisman candidate at Oklahoma (finished #2 to Joe Burrow). He was never that at Alabama. Also, while at Alabama, folks claimed that Hurts' NFL future was likely at RB or on defense. Even after 2018, absolutely no one saw Hurts as an NFL QB. Even Bama fans. So saying "his real improvement came in the NFL" ignores that had it not been for Oklahoma, he would have never gone to the NFL to begin with.

You are going to wait a long time because it isn't going to happen.

So, it is Bill O'Brien's fault that Alabama had 3 subpar players on the OL, no TE capable of playing the position and no WRs with breakaway speed? It is O'Brien's fault that Alabama gave up 56 points and 30 points to Tennessee teams that UGA effectively shut out?

Hall of Fame membership is based on excellent play, not having the best personal story.

Lost to Vanderbilt. Was clearly outplayed by the Vanderbilt QB in epic fashion. The Vandy QB not only had more passing yards than Levis in that game, but he also had more rushing yards than Levis had passing! Maybe these scouts should rate the Vandy QB #1 overall instead.

Bryce Young was sacked 39 times in 2021 and was arguably one play - a dropped TD in the end zone by Cam Latu - from winning a national title. And he would have been sacked even more times if it weren't for his awareness in the pocket, mobility and quick release. A guy in consideration for being the #1 overall pick should be able to elevate a mediocre college cast. As it was, Levis led Kentucky to a 3 way tie for 4th in the SEC East. And this was one of the weakest SEC East fields in memory: Tennessee and South Carolina were both rebuilding with 2nd year coaches, Florida had a disastrous campaign with a 1st year coach, Missouri did just well enough to forestall the inevitable firing of their head coach by another year. The SEC East was so bad that a Vandy team that got killed by Wake Forest and barely got by the likes of Elon and Northern Illinois was able to snag 2 games and came close against Kentucky from getting a third to make themselves bowl eligible. One of the teams that Vandy upset? Why Will Levis and Kentucky. Levis was decisively outplayed by Vandy's Mike Wright AND Levis wasted a 162 yard rushing day by Chris Rodriguez (why they didn't give him and the backup McClain more chances WHEN THEY WERE BOTH GETTING 9 YARDS PER CARRY needs to be explained ... but instead they allowed Levis to handle the ball 30 times and only complete 11 passes, throw a pick and have 6 plays go for negative gain). Sorry, but why people see Levis as a franchise QB needs to be explained. Now I have been wrong before. Looks like I was EVENTUALLY wrong about Daniel Jones. But these franchises do need to play the percentages. Remember: Chicago chose Mitch Trubisky over Pat Mahomes and Deshaun Watson, potentially costing themselves a Super Bowl. (The Bears had receivers, an OL and a great defense back then.) Cleveland chose to grab a DE in the first round in order to take a QB in the second, only to wind up having to waste a #1 overall draft pick on Baker Mayfield and to trade still more draft picks to pick up one of the QBs that they passed up. I don't know why Carolina or anyone else would want to emulate those teams.

Bennett was better than Greg McElroy. There were times such as the infamous Tennessee game where Alabama won in spite of McElroy rather than because of him. Mark Ingram became the first Alabama player AND the rare RB in this era to win a Heisman because they were able to use him in the wildcat on third down and goal line plays, and thereby get McElroy off the field. Bennett had 300 yards passing and 3 TDs in his first title game (against Bama) and 6 TDs in his second title game (against a Texas team). McElroy was 6-11 for 58 yards. Bennett outplayed future 1st round picks Bryce Young and CJ Stroud. McElroy lost a massive 1st half lead to Cam Newton. Granted, McElroy DID get the ball downfield to Julio Jones, which Bennett can't do. Otherwise, Bennett had a better college career and the comparison isn't close.

Make a case for Stetson Bennett IV being in the Hall of Fame that can't also be made for AJ McCarron.

No, don't blame Monken. Monken is UGA's 3rd OC. No WR put up big numbers or got drafted high (without being a prodigy like Pickens or running a 4.3 like Hardman) either. The only constant here is Kirby Smart, and we can conclude that Smart doesn't prioritize developing WRs for the NFL or putting them in position to be high draft picks. While the OLs, DLs, LBs, DBs and RBs who played under Kirby are doing great, the WRs are doing terrible. Hardman is a bust, and all the other WRs who played under Kirby except Isaiah McKenzie (who has hung around as a 4th/5th WR and return specialist) are out of the league. Until Kirby improves this track record, top 100 WRs are rarely going to commit there, and guys are going to keep leaving after 2-3 years of getting 15 catches for 300 yards, if that.

No, Ladd McConkey was going to be the #1 WR. And McConkey, who had the best season for any WR under Kirby Smart, only had 762 yards in 15 games, or about 51 yards a game. The #2 WR had 350 yards. The #3 WR had 320 yards and has decided to take his degree and move on (maybe the Falcons will grab him in the 7th round to appease UGA fans). The #4 WR, a rare 5 star WR recruit for UGA, had 200 yards and hit the portal. It would be different if this was year 1 or 2, but Smart has been at UGA for 6 years and is on his 3rd offensive coordinator. And WRs who leave UGA at times do in fact put up better numbers elsewhere. Matt Landers had 900 yards for Arkansas last year in 13 games despite the starting QB missing 2 games due to injury. (And the #2 WR had 700 yards). And for all the bashing that Jermaine Burton got, his numbers actually did increase from 26 catches for 497 yards and 5 TDs (again in 15 games) to 40 catches for 677 yards and 7 TDs. Yes, Burton had more yards per game than McConkey did, and this was despite the complete mess that Bama was on offense with the injury to Young, the OL issues and the lack of a vertical threat at WR or a functional TE (seriously what has been going on with Alabama's recruiting on offense, DL and ILB the last 3 years?). I repeat: 7 years under Kirby Smart and the only WRs to get taken in the first 4 rounds were the brother of a 1st round pick (Riley Ridley), a guy who ran a 4.3 (Mecole Hardman) and a guy who had rare natural ability that even a ton of 1st round pick WRs don't have (George Pickens). Which means that based on all available evidence, Mitchell and the other guys who split weren't going to get drafted higher than round 5 either.

"Staying with a team seems to give a better option with the draft." With all due respect, what on earth makes you say this? Under Kirby Smart, no WR who doesn't run a 4.3 40 (Hardman) or have ridiculous athletic ability (Pickens) or isn't the brother of a 1st round pick (Ridley) has gotten drafted in th the first 4 rounds. If you look at the numbers that the 2-4 WRs Jacksaint, Jackson and Blaylock put up last season - 350 yards or less - they weren't either. It absolutely makes sense for guys like Burton, Mitchell etc. to leave a program that has no record of - or inclination to - develop WRs for the NFL in favor of programs and coaches that do. As I mentioned just now on Dawgnation, Steve Sarkisian had 4 future #1 draft picks at WR on his 2020 team, and it would have been 5 had Metchie not torn up his knee in the title game 4 months before the draft (and he still went in the 2nd round). And no, those 5 guys generally did not have Pickens' athletic ability or Hardman's speed. They just got to catch plenty of balls in college to showcase and develop their skills. By contrast, Hardman despite his 4.3 speed did not do this, and as a result he is a bust. He has Pat Mahomes getting him the ball and can't reach 700 receiving yards in a single season. By contrast Devonta Smith had almost 1000 yards his rookie season when Jalen Hurts was struggling with the concept of an NFL forward pass and has 1200 yards this year despite sharing the load with AJ Brown and Hurts missing 2 games due to injury. Yes, Justin Fields, who was a 1st round pick and is an NFL starter, made the right decision to leave because there is absolutely no evidence that he would have become those things at UGA. And your Bo Nix thing is hilarious ... the guy was a Heisman candidate until his coach cost them the Washington and Oregon State games with bizarre gameday coaching (even the announcers were questioning why Lanning kept going for it on 4th down and either turning down easy field goals or handing the opposing team the ball in great field position). Nix had 3600 yards and 30 TDs and 72% passing where at Auburn he never surpassed 2500 yards, 16 TDs or 61%. With another strong year - and better coaching - Nix will be a 1st or 2nd round draft pick, especially if the WRs that Lanning has been stockpiling - a 4 star guy in 2022 that redshirted last season and a pair more 4 star WRs in this class - contribute next season.

You don't know what you are talking about. The truth is that Burton set career highs in catches, yards and TDs at Alabama and did so by some margin. Meanwhile the #2 WR at Georgia, Jacksaint, had half the receiving yards that Burton did despite playing in 2 more games. Burton didn't put up good enough numbers to jump to the NFL this season as he intended, but he certainly put up better numbers than he would have had he remained in Athens. And in case you didn't notice, Ladd McConkey didn't put up good enough numbers to enter the NFL either. McConkey's receiving yards per game were actually LESS than Burton's.

It makes plenty of success. Ladd McConkey has the most receiving yards ever under Kirby Smart, and that was only 760 yards - 50 a game - in a 15 game season. The #2, #3 and #4 WRs only had 300 and 200 yards, including Kearis Jackson, who entered the draft because he knew there was no point in returning and Dominick Blaylock who transferred. UGA's system doesn't allow WRs to put up the numbers necessary to become anything more than 6th round draft picks and undrafted free agents in the NFL. The only exception are guys who can run a 4.3 40 like Mecole Hardman or who have super elite ability like George Pickens. So what do you expect WRs who have the talent to do more to do?

Huh? You are being bizarre considering that the ACC has dealt 3 of the last 4 losses of SEC teams in playoff/title games (FSU over Auburn, Clemson over Alabama, Clemson over Alabama). Take away the ACC and the rest of college football combined has 1 such win - Ohio State over Alabama - and even that was due to Lane Kiffin's deciding to have a former RB/DB turned QB throw the ball 40 times instead of just handing it off (which is what Ohio State did). Even just last year, we had FSU - who didn't even win their division - beat the SEC West champs LSU, and unlike UGA, FSU played a healthy Jayden Daniels. Also, putting up video game numbers in the SEC will require having a QB, which Tech hasn't since Joe Hamilton. Well, that isn't fair ... they've had some decent guys, but it is amazing how they went from having the most interesting dual threat guys in the southeast (even Charlie Ward went to FSU because he didn't academically qualify ... he originally planned to go to Georgia Tech) from the late 80s through the late 90s to going on 20 years of being unable to consistently manage a forward pass.

Plenty of people wanted to play an Alabama that had a bad OL, no vertical threats among their WRs, a TE with hands of stone that defenses left open on purpose, tons of penalties and absolutely no playmakers in the middle of their defense. Alabama was the #4 team in the SEC this year. They lost to #2 and #3 head to head and would have gotten slaughtered by #1. They won 3 other 1 score games against pedestrian teams, but two of them required very questionable officiating, especially the no-call of the safety against a Texas team playing its 2nd best QB (but also the no-call in pass interference in the end zone against a 5-7 Texas A&M playing its 2nd best QB). Yes, they blew out Kansas State, but Kansas State was the #2 team in the Big 12 and you saw what UGA did to the #1 team. Also, Bama's players chose not to opt out of that game, mainly because they knew that the risk of injury was low (if it was a bowl game against a Big 10 or big time ACC team they would have sat out). If you give Alabama's resume to Michigan State or Arizona State, people would say that they are maybe a top 10 team. No one would call them a title contender.

@RonMexico: In what universe? UGA can claim that they didn't want the QB. But they absolutely did want the #1 safety in the country and the #1 RB in the country (a legacy of a fondly remembered player, the son of the "hobnail boot" call RB). UGA immediately started recruiting other guys after those 2 signed with Bama.

Smart should surpass Saban's accomplishments at Alabama. Saban early on had to contend with Florida (2008 title, 2009 #2), LSU (2007 title, 2011 #2), Auburn (2010 title, 2013 #2) to a lesser extent UGA (2012 #2). There isn't anything like that in the SEC right now. Alabama's run is over. Next season they are going to have 2 new coordinators for the first time. Their QB will either be Ty Simpson - 4 career passing yards - or Jalen Milroe, who isn't a passer. But even if Simpson or Milroe was the next Mac Jones, it wouldn't matter. Bama has nothing but average players at best at WR, TE and RB, and their OL is going to be even worse. Who else is there? I will believe in a Big 12 style team when they actually win a game that matters. OK fine ... TCU beat Michigan. But UGA completely defenstrated both Tennessee and TCU. The Vols aren't a threat until Heupel hires an OC that runs an offense that works in this conference. Florida and Auburn are massive rebuilding jobs. That leaves LSU, except there is no evidence that Kelly can recruit there like Saban and Miles did. Nationally, who is there, really? Texas and USC have helped UGA out by hiring a pair of proven losers. Clemson is on their third OC in 3 years. Michigan appears to be in trouble with the NCAA somehow. Ohio State I guess? I am not picking UGA next season, because with the latest guys to announce they are entering the draft, UGA could actually have 27 guys drafted in 2 years. But don't be shocked if they don't follow the dip next year with going back-to-back the 2 seasons right after. If Monken leaves all bets are off. (Though nothing to stop UGA from hiring his understudy back from Georgia Tech.) But that is about the only thing that can stop them right now.