First and 10: The truth hurts, but here it is. Tennessee, you will never be elite again
1. I don’t want to get on a soapbox, but …
I’ve got some harsh words for those in power at Tennessee, something they don’t want to hear but better embrace.
It’s not the 1990s anymore. Tennessee will never be elite again.
After yet another coach failed to make it work on Rocky Top and Jeremy Pruitt was fired after 3 seasons and amid an NCAA investigation, it can no longer be denied: The days of Tennessee consistently winning big and competing at the highest level of college football are long gone.
I said it 3 years ago when the Vols made their 4th hire in 10 years and will say it again and again until those on Rocky Top can hear it loud and clear. Until the most relentless, raucous and thin-skinned fan base (I say this lovingly, Vols fans) in all of college football finally and humbly capitulates.
It’s over, folks.
You might get a one-off season every now and then where the Vols make it to the SEC Championship Game. You might strike lightning in a bottle and land a recruit everyone missed (see: Lamar Jackson), and he might be enough to win the East Division.
But this program will never again win like it did in the golden years of Phil Fulmer and Peyton Manning and Tee Martin and Al Wilson. Never.
Tennessee will never be elite again.
There’s a simple reason for this declaration, and it’s as undeniable as the long line of failure at Tennessee since Fulmer was forced out after the 2008 season: players.
Players win championships. The more elite players you have, the greater your chance of winning – and winning big.
Tennessee is the SEC’s version of Nebraska, a former college football power that continues to circulate through coaching failures without addressing the true north reason.
Players.
It’s always about players, and more important, player procurement. And it’s never been more difficult for Tennessee to get enough elite players to make a difference.
“There’s no draw, there’s no recent history,” a former Vols assistant coach told me. “Kids today don’t know Tee Martin was a national championship quarterback. They know Tee Martin, the coach. You know what all of these (recruits) see? Bad football. You’re not getting guys who will change the direction of your program with bad football, no matter how you sell it.”
Those players of years past made Fulmer a Hall of Fame coach. Those players helped the Vols roll through a 45-5 record in the late 1990s, including a national title and 2 SEC championships.
But the days of Tennessee getting who it wants – or even close to it – in the South have been gone for years. The Vols aren’t going into Louisiana and getting Manning, or Alabama and getting Martin, or Georgia and getting Jamal Lewis. Hell, they’re not beating Clemson or South Carolina for Shaun Ellis.
Fulmer and his staff capitalized on program regressions at Alabama, LSU and Georgia to land some of the best players in the history of the program. Tennessee hasn’t beaten Georgia or LSU for a legitimate impact recruit in more than a decade, and both Georgia and LSU have gone through coaching changes and turmoil.
Tennessee has beaten Florida once since Fulmer was pushed out after the 2008 season, and hasn’t landed a true difference-maker recruit from the state of Florida over that span.
The Vols’ recruiting footprint is the state of Tennessee — and fighting an uphill battle in the South. Or potentially using an illegal move (see: Pruitt firing).
This isn’t hyperbole, these are tangible, real reasons it hasn’t worked at Tennessee – and why it won’t moving forward. At least, not to the level to satisfy a rabid fan base.
This is the same fan base that 3 years ago ran off Greg Schiano, who looks like Vince Lombardi compared to the P.E. coach that is Pruitt.
The same university that allowed a former beloved coach (Fulmer) to torpedo what could’ve been a unique and intriguing hire (Mike Leach) that might have led to one of those one-off seasons, and then allowed the former beloved coach to make things worse.
Everyone is on the hook for this mess. From the university bigwigs who in 2009 signed off on Lane Kiffin – he wasn’t ready, and he absolutely was leaving should the USC job open up (of course it was opening up; the Trojans were staring at the NCAA sheriff) – to everyone who made every wrong move along the way since, to the Tennessee administration with hat in hand Monday afternoon proclaiming they will get it right this time.
It’s a tragic comedy of a 12-year run that has led to 4 football coaches and 2 interim coaches sludging through a 73-75 record. Just barely average.
This is what you are, Tennessee. Now and for the foreseeable future.
An average team with Alabama dreams. An average team that can’t recruit like it once did, and won’t ever recruit well enough to sustain elite success.
Tennessee will never be elite again.
2. The how and why
We’ve heard it over and over from every fan base, not just the loyal Vols fans.
Who says we can’t find our own version of Dabo Swinney?
Because there’s only one Dabo. Just like there’s one Saban and one Urban Meyer and after that, there’s a deep, deep chasm to the rest of college football coaching fiefdom.
Want to know who can take the current Tennessee situation – with its inherent geographical footprint recruiting issues and lack of elite high school players in the state of Tennessee – and win big?
Start with the aforementioned three coaches, and it ends there.
Saban will retire from Alabama when he’s good and ready. Meyer is in the NFL, and Swinney’s next move, more than likely, is the NFL.
Those are the only three coaches with the track record and trophy case – and charisma – to annually recruit top-5 recruiting classes to Tennessee and win a national championship.
The obvious question for the Tennessee administration: Where do you settle?
It begins and ends with hiring a coach who won’t run afoul of the NCAA. If you’re hiring to run one of the top seven SEC programs, it damn sure better be an experienced head coach.
If for some unknown reason you’ve decided to not hire an experienced head coach (see: falling down the same rabbit hole unless he’s the perfect candidate), it better be someone with a nearly flawless track record of working at major programs and someone with a spotless résumé on and off the field.
That list is about 2-3 assistant coaches long — and wouldn’t have included Pruitt in the last go-round.
Again, this is reality. It’s hard to hear if you’re a loyal Vols fan and you can’t understand why this proud program has looked so painfully dysfunctional since the last time it won an SEC championship. That was 1998.
Even the 2001 team, the group that won close games in a tough, 9/11 season, only needed to beat 3-loss LSU to play Nebraska in the BCS Championship Game. And lost.
LSU had two quarterbacks who couldn’t throw that day, and averaged 3.7 yards per play – and still won by 11 points.
That was the first of many gut-punches Vols fans have had to endure over the last two decades. There will be more.
3. The next move
They said all the right things at Monday’s press conference. They talked of winning the right way, getting things turned around and finding the right coach.
There was also this from UT chancellor Donde Plowman: “We are looking at some serious potential NCAA violations.”
One SEC source told me Monday night the number of violations could exceed 30, depending on mitigation.
So where does Tennessee turn? The Team Turmoil days of the last 12 years already have soured the job for some coaches, including the Power 5 coaches who turned down the job 3 years ago (Mike Gundy, Dave Doeren, Jeff Brohm).
Who wants to walk into a situation with a fan base that expects greatness despite the obvious player procurement drawbacks, and with potential NCAA probation?
Tennessee officials say they want to hire an athletic director first and let him or her hire the football coach. Longtime SEC assistant Kevin Steele, who was hired by Pruitt less than a week ago, is the interim coach – and may be the last man standing when the storm blows over.
Tennessee can’t hire Liberty coach Hugh Freeze – and natural choice because of his history and success in the SEC – after it fired Pruitt for NCAA violations. Freeze had NCAA violations at Ole Miss, and those problems and personal behavior issues forced him out.
If you’re Billy Napier (an assistant under both Saban and Swinney) and you’ve built a strong program at Louisiana, do you really want to be dropped into that mess – or is it more prudent to wait another year for another SEC job to open? Eight of the 14 SEC coaches who began the 2019 season have been fired.
Matt Campbell isn’t leaving Iowa State for Tennessee. Nor will Tom Allen leave Indiana.
The Vols, more than likely, will wind up offering the job to a Power 5 assistant coach, or a coach who can’t say no. A coach who goes from making a few hundred thousand coaching in the depths of the Group of 5 (Coastal Carolina’s Jamey Chadwell) to making a few million a year in the SEC.
It worked with Eliah Drinkwitz at Missouri. Maybe it works again in Knoxville.
4. The path to leadership
Too many athletic departments get too ingrained in the idea of hiring someone to run the department with close ties to the university.
Seriously, who cares?
Go hire the best person for the job and give them every opportunity to succeed — and everything they need to make the impact needed. In other words, stay out of the way.
It’s not that difficult.
Instead of constantly focusing on Alabama and Clemson and the Nick Saban and Dabo Swinney coaching trees to hire head coaches, why not focus on the foundation at those programs?
If Tennessee truly wanted to make a unique and daring move, it would hire 37-year-old Graham Neff as athletic director. The deputy athletic director at Clemson, Neff works under one of the most accomplished and respected ADs in college sports (Dan Radakovich).
Just how impressive has Neff been? Radakovich created the deputy job for him and has used Neff’s counsel on everything from coaching hires to facilities planning and fundraising.
One Power 5 AD told me Monday night that Neff, “is a rock star” and that he’ll run his own athletic department within the next year or two.
Why not a department at Tennessee that desperately needs new ideas from a fresh perspective?
5. The Weekly Five
The top five candidates for the Tennessee job (and one bonus):
1. P.J. Fleck, Minnesota: The dream candidate. Has everything Tennessee needs: sparkling track record and charisma, and a booming personality to attract recruits. But the dream candidate is also more than likely a pipedream. He’s happy in Minneapolis, and it’s a personality fit.
2. Tony Elliott, Clemson offensive coordinator: A critical factor in Clemson’s rise under Swinney, he has been waiting for the perfect job. This may not be it. He will be a star when he finally accepts a Power 5 job.
3. Jamey Chadwell, Coastal Carolina: Is it possible to parlay 1 winning season in 3 years at Coastal into a Power 5 job? It’s Tennessee, everyone. Anything is possible.
4. Josh Heupel, UCF: He has the Bob Stoops pedigree (no, Bob Stoops isn’t interested), and he’s 28-8 in 3 seasons at UCF.
5. Jeff Monken, Army: No, he won’t run the triple option – but his give no quarter attitude and history of producing smart, tough teams is exactly what this program needs.
Bonus: Bill O’Brien, former Houston Texans coach. He cleaned up a much larger mess at Penn State. The only question: How long would he stay before moving back to the NFL?
6. Your tape is your résumé
The deadline to apply for the NFL draft has arrived. An NFL scout breaks down a draft-eligible SEC player. This week: Texas A&M DT Bobby Brown III.
“It’s a down year for interior guys on the defensive front, and that’s going to help him. He’s a big guy (6-4, 325 pounds), a load in the middle. He can get after the quarterback, and I love those interior guys that can give you a pass rush push. At the beginning of the season, he would’ve been a mid-round guy. But he’s intriguing, if for no other reason because of his size and athletic ability. He hasn’t done it consistently and probably should’ve stayed another season. But he’s one of those guys who saw what happened in this COVID season and wants no part of playing again for free. Can you blame him? If he shines in individual workouts, and interviews well, I could see him moving up into the lower second or early third. That size and athleticism will push a handful of teams to value him higher than they should.”
7. Powered Up
This week’s Power Poll: Best prospects for 2022 NFL Draft (1 per school):
- Alabama: LB Christian Harris
- Texas A&M: C Luke Matthews
- Florida: DE/LB Brenton Cox
- Georgia: DE Nolan Smith
- LSU: CFB Derek Stingley Jr.
- Ole Miss: OT Nick Broeker
- Auburn: LB Owen Pappoe
- Missouri: CB Jarvis Ware
- Kentucky: DE Joshua Paschal
- Arkansas: WR De’Vion Warren
- Tennessee: S Trevon Flowers
- Mississippi State: OT Charles Cross
- South Carolina: S R.J. Roderick
- Vanderbilt: CB Allan George
8. Ask and you shall receive
Matt: A couple of weeks ago you wrote that Dan Mullen and Florida weren’t getting along. Can you update?
Jane Francis
Miami
Jane: Mullen isn’t happy about having to fire two assistants connected to the program’s first NCAA probation in more than 30 years. The university isn’t happy about Mullen’s part in the NCAA probation, or his postgame behavior in three separate incidents (Texas A&M, Missouri, Oklahoma games). Bottom line: Mullen has no NFL options to move on, and the football results on the field (for now) are too difficult to ignore for the university. So they’ll move forward with him. But understand this: The university won’t put up with another NCAA issue and won’t choke down more behavior that damages its brand.
9. Numbers: 46
When Bryan Harsin took the job at Auburn, there were concerns about his knowledge of the SEC and recruiting in the South. Since his arrival, he has made 5 hires who have a combined 46 years of experience coaching in the SEC. The main hires – offensive coordinator Mike Bobo (15 years) and defensive coordinator Derek Mason (7 years) – are also critical to Auburn’s ability to recruit the Southeast.
10. Quote to note
From the termination letter of Tennessee chancellor Donde Plowman and AD Phil Fulmer to Jeremy Pruitt: “Your failures are likely to lead to significant penalties to the university and has jeopardized the eligibility of our student-athletes.”
Glad you can predict the future. I’ll admit I quit reading after the first few sentences, but it’s just another jab at UT. We’ve made bad choices over that last few coaches. That can happen to anyone. It’s just happened to us multiple times in a row. The cupboard is not bare. We have talent. Just need a competent coaching staff and one we can keep longer than 3 years. We get consistency and no reason we can be back in the discussion. There is too much money going around to think we can’t be elite ever again.
Delusion truly is spelled H-I-L-L-B-I-L-L-Y.
Nah its spelled Corch Irvin Meyers, New USC Trojans Corch(2020)
LOL. Your continued delusion went from hilarious to sad to back to hilarious all in one season.
It’s never not going to be funny from now to infinity.
Oh look, another Georgia fan that thinks they can laugh at programs that are having issues Corch Irvin Meyers, New USC Trojans Corch, 1980. It’s funny when a team wins a few games for a few years and they think they can step up with the big boys and laugh and talk poo, 1980. That’s really not nice making fun of a fellow SEC school that in the same division as you are, 1980. Want to know delusion? here ya go UGA 1980!!!!!! :) wow what a progam! 1980 ROFLMAO
@ NoogaLoots so what has UT done to make you feel superior? Georgia has won 3 SEC Championships and 8 division titles, since UT won its last, 22 years ago. UT has won one national championship in the last 53 years. You have nothing to be superior about and your program is not in the same league as UGA. Live with it.
1980 :)
That’s what I was thinking. 1998 is definitely newer than 1980.
corch, you’re georgia’s wolfman. How does it feel. To all others, do not respond to his posts. Maybe he’ll go away.
So true
This guy must LOVE TN your on our team site on Saturday Down South not your own. That’s what’s funny. What’s gonna be even better is when they find out since Mims didn’t take our money why would he turn that down and go to GA oh wait hello NCAA
Then by your reasoning since Cam Newton’s father turned the money down at Miss. State, he must have gotten more to play at AU. The only problem with that is the investigation did not find that to be true.
Dude, this type of comment is entirely unnecessary, and reflects poorly on yourself.
For the last time coach, me and I think most of America, except Fla and GA maybe, would MUCH rather be a hillbilly over a redneck.
You would starve to death without redneck. You obviously do not know where the term comes from. You might want to light a shuck out of here.
Hey Crotch Of Urban Meyer, don’t forget your ugly arse was torn by Florida and Bama. Now like a good dog go back to your cage before you get kicked again….you have been in that cage since 1980.
The reaction couldn’t be more perfect from a VolTard could it? The guy just gives you a great road map to be relevant again, and gives you all a spark of hope down the line, if only Vol fans would engage in reality. But nope! Vol fan goes for the delusional instant gratification of “if we could just get the right guy in there!” LMAO. Fans are also a huge reason as to why Tennessee will never be elite again.
No big name coaches want to coach at Tennessee because your program sucks and none of you fans have any class.
Glad I never went to a UT Game at Neyland Stadium. I think I could bare one single second being around you deplorables.
That’s not true. The same can be said about Georgia as far as the program sucking and each and every one of their fans having no class, but they managed to get lucky just once with the Beaver. They won’t win a national championship with him and NCAA violations aplenty are happening in Athens that would make whatever UT has done pale in comparison. But don’t sit there and say it can’t happen for UT. It happened at Georgia, a perennial middle of the pack SEC team.
My biggest fear about UT is at the rate that they fire head coaches these days, the proverbial blind squirrel just might eventually find that nut and they could accidentally hire someone competent. Nobody wants to see that.
UT had their run of success 20+ years ago. It’s over. Time for you to get back to watching Andy Griffith reruns all day.
“perennial middle of the pack SEC team”
Only in your sad little head is that true
Anybody think that firing Fulmer in 2008 can now be considered a bad decision ?
76-8 wins a year….how about 3 to 4. No more bowl games for you! The Vols next coach….Mickey Mouse.
Fulmer had 2 losing seasons out of 3. That would get you fired from most schools in the SEC.
It’s bear, not bare.
They also still think tRump won. Ha!
Deplorables? Hillary is that you? If not you must be one of those snowflakes whose parents demanded you get a participation trophy because you SUCK at sports
stay made you poor vol fan
*mad
Made it back home from terrorizing the Capitol yet?
Wow. And which team are you with? UT fans have been praised by many other fans as being kind and respectful. And since you have never been to a game you really don’t know now do you. At this point I welcome you to come see just how gracious and kind the fans of this program our. We are passionate and do bleed orange. Thru thick and thin and NCAA problems. We are committed to the program. Maybe you should try showing that respect to yourself because something tells me that when you look in the mirror you are very disappointed at the person you have become.
UT fans are more Nasty to their own program than to others. They are thin skinned and have an overinflated opinion of their program, but that does not make them unique. I would rather watch a night game at Neyland than Tiger stadium at BR as far as safety. And I am a retired Louisiana law enforcement officer.
I think the NCAA is about to step on Tennessee’s face with a hobnailed boot. How does this program find a coach that can rebuild it? If an outsider comes in and has success rebuilding this trainwreck, they will have multiple offers from top 10 programs. I think the only hope UT has for turning this thing around is to find a former player who will stay once there is some success. I know a guy who’s never been a coach but I think he would be a damm good one. I think Peyton Manning is the only guy who could turn this program around anytime soon. Otherwise it may never happen. Does Manning love the program enough to come in and save it?
“I think the NCAA is about to step on Tennessee’s face with a hobnailed boot.”
I think so too. I watched UT’s press conference today and it looked like that’s what they’re expecting. I suspect this will set the Vols’ program back for years to come.
LOL Peyton Manning isnt going to coach the Vols. Thats not a knock on Tennessee but he is a 1st ballad hall of famer, hes not going to come coach the program.
ballad? Peyton sings? try BALLOT
Or maybe Tennessee makes a Hail Mary pass to win in the final seconds and come out on top.
Weak attempt at trash talk, that was 5 seasons ago. There have been a lot of blowout losses since then.
Peyton Manning is far too intelligent to ever want to be a head coach.
“Does Manning love the program enough to come in and save it?”
…NOPE!
He knows a dead fish when he smells it. And Tennessee is a dead fish.
Agreed. This is a click bait article to increase blood pressure. Tennessee has some of the best facilities and fan base in the nation. It’s really the only power school in the state and the booster money power is there as well. In state recruiting is only getting better by the massive number of people moving to a low cost of living state with no income tax. U-Haul report came out yesterday that more trucks are being sent into Tennessee than any other state in 2020.
Well, I assume all those fired coaches need moving trucks.
The only reason U-haul’s are being sent to Tennessee, are to pick up ex UT coaches every other day… it seems that way anyway…
Ya, ya , ya. The Vols blew their real chance here. They should have got Butch jones before he went to Arkansas State. Butch is the only one of the clowns in recent years to win, even as the alumni tried to get him out. He got the last laugh.$$$$$$$$
Best facilities and fan base…You mean mediocre (by sec standards) facilities, and a delusional dimwitted fanbase that thinks that they are just a few breaks away from glory once again. Funny how all of these advantages (that you think you have) haven’t resulted in anything close to a great season well over a decade now.
This guy really said fan base LOL!!!! Tennessee has the most delusional fans in the freakin’ country!
Maybe I’m myopic, but currently there seems to be room for only 3-4 top-tier programs, in alphabetical order: Alabama, Clemson, Oklahoma, Ohio St, with a few followers–the second tier–who occasionally get lucky and crash the party. I’d include Georgia, LSU, Notre Dame, and Oregon in this second group. There maybe 3-6 other teams–look out for Texas A&M with that Texas oil money to possibly move into this second tier–that bite at the heels of the second tier, but none of them are serious contenders. Maybe things will shake up a bit when Saban retires or Dabo goes to the NFL. When that happens, it will likely be someone in the second tier that moves up (I’d bet on Oregon and that Nike money).
Regardless, Tennessee is the SEC version of Nebraska. Tennessee can aspire to be a good team–potentially a top-15 team or even top 8 if they happen to knock off Florida and Georgia–but they will get blasted by the Alabama’s and LSU’s (or Texas A&M) in the SEC championship game. That’s the best Tennessee can hope for.
They sure ain’t going there for the football. Tax breaks, yeah, football, no way.
I think this is the most brutal article I ever read here.
“I think this is the most brutal article I ever read here.”
^^^ AGREED ^^^
The CEO should be called out on Twitter and CNN/MSNBC and then the site should be shutdown by Amazon. UT gets a trophy no matter how they finished. Those poor UT fans.
You must be hanging out in Madisonville again. The boys got you thinking crooked again. UT is a basketball school, son, and don’t you forget it.
Get back in the discussion? Discussion for WHAT? You are just one of those delusional dreamers that thinks a switch can be flipped, and UT will start magically recruiting in states that have infinitely better football programs. The state of Tennessee will never have enough prospects to elevate this program anywhere near the top. You people have been claiming you’re “back” for more than a decade now, and you are right back in the abyss, staring at a 1-7 or 0-8 in the SEC record next year.
Clemson to the east. A resurgent Florida and Georgia close by. You can’t even count on plucking players from Kentucky anymore now that UK has surpassed you. It’s over. Bury the Vol corpse on Rocky Top and spend your fall afternoons hunting or fishing.
We all know this is clickbait; never is a very long time.
One of Tennessee’s biggest problems has been Phil Fulmer’s incessant scheming. Maybe now UT can put that issue behind it permanently. He’s the reason Greg Schiano or Mike Leach aren’t up there right now. Who knows if either would have worked, but they would have had a better shot than the recent Fulmer/Pruitt mashup.
The SEC East isn’t some insurmountable mountain. Florida and Georgia are good, but they’re not flawless; the rest of the division is completely manageable. I don’t think that Tennessee can be consistently elite, but that’s not the same as saying it can never have elite teams.
LOL. You said everything I and anyone with a modicum of common sense have been saying about Tennessee for years.
They live in a talent-poor state, and after Mark Richt shut down Fat Phil’s Atlanta pipeline (you failed to give Richt credit for Tennessee’s downfall, but he’s the guy who did it), that was all she wrote for the Vawls.
Enjoy your 7-8 wins a year life, Vawls. Enjoy being Arkansas.
1980.
We’re going to win a national title soon, and more than likely multiple ones, and you know it.
And you also know, deep down in your Nothing Sucks Like A Big Orange Heart that y’all will never win another one again.
You’ll probably not even win another SEC Title.
You’re through. And you know it.
The moment we win a national title, and again, it will be soon enough, we’re coming for all you Hillbillies who actually think this is some kind of insult.
Lmao are you a psychic?
Honestly, I don’t think you will.
You continue to do less with more as Kirby is showing that he doesn’t have the tactical prowess to compete with the likes of Bama and Clemson.
I think the recruting boom that Georgia has experienced will decline as recruits realize that a New Years bowl game is the best he will ever muster.
Instead, the likes of Texas A&M and other programs will take Georgia’s place as recruiting hot spot and “next best thing.”
Simply put: Kirby had his chance at “up and coming contender.”
If you think it’s “over” for Kirby, you’re even more delusional than I originally thought.
Wow, you people are duuuuumb.
For the last time you illiterate swine. There is NO national championship for the #1 recruiting class. You Athens inbreeders can print up as many Tshirts as you like and sell as many commemorative rings for your recruiting national titles, but you will never ever win a football national championship.
You are more deluded than the UT fans. They just want to get back to what they once were way back when, but they are under no illusions as to how bad of a dumpster fire they currently are. You Georgia fans just cannot accept that god hates you, no matter how plain it is to see for the rest of us.
Gromit should change his handle to Vomit. Go puke on yourself.
“You Georgia fans just cannot accept that god hates you, no matter how plain it is to see for the rest of us.”
You’re a sick and delusional person.
What a disgusting post by an even more disgusting person (Gromit). Your posts are filled with lies, misunderstandings and extreme bias for the team you root for. Someday when you grow up, you’ll learn what an objective take is. What a moron.
Been hearing this national title or bust trash from UGA fans for decades now. Put up or shut up!
The only national title georgia will win is on the playstation
Yeah, we get it. 1980. But UGA > Tennessee
It is not national championship or bust and there is a big difference between UGA and Tennessee.
UGA has three SEC titles since Tennessee last won one. UGA has been to four consecutive NY6 bowls. When did Tennessee last go to one? Kids born that year can drive now.
Enjoy 1998, but it is getting a little long in the tooth and soon anyone with only half a brain will start using it as an insult
Sadly for Georgia, and despite Tennessee spending 15 years in the wilderness, Tennessee is still a bigger program than Georgia. Tennessee is still number 2 historically in the SEC.
1980 is indicative of Georgia’s history: perennial underachievers and nearly men.
lol no, Tennessee is not a “bigger” program. This is the exact delusion that this article is trying to address.
Boxster nailed it. TN is a mid major now. You must live in the here and now, not 20 to 30 years ago. Right now, UGA is a far better program than TN. It will stay that way for the foreseeable future. The writer is correct about the TN delusions. They are rampant. You guys are a mid major now. Get used to it.
He’s talking about wins. Add despite our 15 year slump, we still have more wins all time which is a fact. I think that is all he is saying. Pretty obvious uga is in a better situation right now than UT but to say a school with this much history and money going around cannot ever get back to elite is more delusional.
For all time wins UT has 849, and Georgia has 839. It probably won’t take more than two or three years and Georgia will overtake UT in all time wins for second place. LSU and Auburn are catching up too.
UT can definitely be elite again. Everything moves in cycles.
So let’s look at those all-time winningest programs and how relevant that is to the here and now. All-time rank followed by 2020 record:
(5) Michigan 2-4
(7) Texas 7-3
(9) Penn State 4-5
(10) Nebraska 3-5
(11) Tennessee 3-7
(12) FSU 3-6
(14) LSU 5-5
(16) Florida 8-4
(17) Auburn 6-5
(20) Arizona State 2-2
Yes, exactly half of the top 20 all-time programs laid an egg to some degree in 2020. Tennessee was arguably the worst of the bunch.
Come to Atlanta and visit the College Football Hall of Fame. That’s about the only place these all-time records count for anything.
IDK why the Tennessee fans insist on trying to pull other teams (mostly UGA) down with them, but I’m not falling for it… And say what you want about Richt/Smart, but Tennessee would trade the last 15 years with UGA in a heartbeat. And if they could lure Kirby away from UGA, the whole fanbase would need a clean pair of undies. The whole “He’s done less with more” is a self-defeating argument. Our time will come, same as Death and Taxes. Kirby will break through, and then the jab will be “Only one title” since 1980, or some other weak jab.
Actually Smell the Glove – UGA has a overall winning record against UT and has a better all-time winning percentage against SEC teams than UT.
“Our time will come, same as Death and Taxes. Kirby will break through…”
…Christ will return one day too…just a question of WHEN?
There is a decent chance that had Smart not spent more than half the season mishandling his QB position this year that right now we’d be talking about Georgia winning its first national title in forty years and whether it had stopped Alabama’s dynasty with the start of its own. But it always seems to be that way with Smart where he stops himself with some bone-headed decision or inability to handle his offense properly. He may figure it out soon, but until then there’s going to be more “if onlys” for Georgia fans to suffer through.
Kirby didn’t cause Jamie Newman to opt out at the last minute. In fact, right now his bringing in JT Daniels when Jamie had already transferred to UGA looks positively brilliant. We’d be heading into 2021 with no experience at QB otherwise.
That is the hottest take I have ever seen. JT Daniels or not, Georgia was not beating Alabama in 2020. All it would have done is given us the chance to lose two games to you guys, maybe a third.
UGA had a late 3rd quarter lead in Tuscaloosa before Stetson imploded and tossed two killer picks. With JT at the controls, I think that game would have come down to the last possession.
Bama fans ahve gotten way more arrogant than their coach.
UGA was not going to beat Alabama this year. There were better offensive and defensive teams that tried and they could not do it. now next season it might be a different story, but no one was beating Bama in 2020.
UGA scored zero points in the second half…
AlwaysnextyearU…
See BT, that’s kinda the point. UGA had a lead over Bama in the second half – something no one else in CFB managed – and things fell apart with the QB. Positing a healthy JT instead of Stetson taking the game down to the wire is no great feat of imagination.
It’s actually a huge feat if imagination because in your mind is the only place it’s happened..
Numerous teams have scored on Bama in the second half.. Ole miss had the game tied in the 4th…..
Keep living in fantasy land though… We can tell it’s the offseason when UGA fans starts giving everyone the woulda, coulda, shoulda speech’s again…
At least they’ve been there this century lol
Richt was 6-4 against UT. Not exactly a beat down. Oh, and he was 2-8 vs. FL.
what world do you live in? richt was 10-5. also, that wasn’t richt’s record against uf either. rather than correct you on the record, i’ll focus on how sad the state of the tn program is that you’re attempting to bring positivity to yourself in boasting an entirely different team’s record against uga. sad!
Rich coached at UGA for 15 years…and some how he only was able to pull 10 games. This site is becoming a bit much.
Blocking some painful memories are we?
vol1 do you Vols fans ever think about taking up a hobby? Just to take your mind away from the 25 year long misery? I think it would be good for your mental health.
Crotch of Urban Meyer, how does in smell down there, take a sniff of that crotch like a dog that you are! LOL. Florida and Bama will beat your ugly British ass again and again and again…
This from a genius who can’t even get his screen name right. English IS a very tough second language, I’m told.
Hey don’t make assumptions. He may like to kick poppies. I don’t see the point in kicking flowers but everyone as a kinky side. LOL
What a stupid article. Tennessee has and always will have the potential to be a national power, all they lack is the right leadership in their program. Sure, it will be hard as hell to get to the level of Georgia or Florida, and almost impossible to get to the level of Alabama, but to sit at your keyboard with Cheeto-stained fingers and type such a declarative statement isn’t just stupid and insulting, it’s unprofessional.
I’m a huge UGA fan and I agree. UTk, Nebraska and Michigan will all return to a similar level of their 1990s selves. To think anything else is asinine at best
LOL. No, they won’t. Michigan could, but they don’t care. Nebraska and Tennessee can’t because they exist in talent-poor states and can no longer recruit nationally. Keep up.
You, sir , are an idiot
Crotch of Urban Meyer…sniff sniff good dog…1980
Honestly, it’s the same for Clemson. They are a missing Dabo away from going back to mediocrity. South Carolina is not exactly rolling in talent either (more than Tennessee, but not enough to maintain their current level).
It’s bad enough The SEC is embarrassed by having Georgia act like it’s good these days. The last thing we need is for UT to accidentally make a good coaching hire and somehow return to winning football games again.
I think there will be shootings in the streets if that somehow happens and my worry is, the rate at which UT fires head coaches only increases the chances that they might mistakenly hire someone who knows what they’re doing one of these days.
Well Vomit, since you are a Gaturd fan let’s address that ridiculous situation. For some reason the UF administration didn’t fire Mullet this year after Mullet completely embarrassed the university time after time. He made a complete a$$ of himself the entire year. After the season was over and Mullen started looking for NFL jobs I saw a lot of UF fans criticizing the clown for the way he conducted himself this year. No loyalty begets no loyalty. The Gaturds and Mullet deserve one another.
Gotta agree doubledawg. Tennessee has waaaaay too much money not to compete if they get the right people in the admin and coaches. The whole time reading that was, wow this feels like an article that’s supposed to rile up and get comments.
Congrats, you got your comments Matt
I agree with Doubledawg. Yeah Tenn is down but to say they are finished forever is asinine. One good coach can turn things around. Look at Indiana or Iowa State. Tennessee is far better job than those places.
There is a difference in having good seasons and what Tennessee fans expect. When is the last time Indiana played for or won the Big-10? Made the playoffs? Won a title? Prior to this year, when was the last time Iowa State played for the Big-12 title? Made the Playoffs? Won a title?
Do you think that is what Tennessee fans envision themselves as? A team that occassionally finishes second in the East and loses to an unranked team in a bowl? Watch their coach walk to another school when another, higher tier job opens up?
People point to the Indiana and Iowa States of the world, but it proves the point of the article…those teams may have a one off season, but they are not going to have extended success. They are also considered stepping stone jobs for their coaches.
UT will be back. Money in a university’s athletic association is the primary factor. UT has that in bunches.
Tennessee does have the ability to once again become one of the top programs in the SEC and by extension the country, but right now there is a ton of toxicity in the program that’s going to make finding the right guy to do it practically impossible. They may have to hire someone that can be a sacrificial lamb and at least get them through what is going to be a rough stretch the next 3-4 years if the Vols get hit with serious sanctions while cleaning up the mess in the administration. And they really are going to have to start recruiting better on a national level; it’s how Saban has been able to keep reloading at Alabama despite losing lots of players to the NFL each year. But again, there may be some broken glass to crawl through before Tennessee can be in position to do that again.
UTK is a dumpster fire … but this too shall pass. Things go in cycles. Great state, good university, facilities, campus improvements, etc. While UTK has been its own worse enemy, things can change. Leadership and recruiting …sounds easy!
It is true, though cruelly put. Tennessee does not have the recruiting base to stock a team with enough talent to be what they once were. While they have been down, too many teams in the south have ascended, and they poach a lot of talent themselves. Even with the sure knowledge that Alabama will not be at this level forever, the southeast has become home to too many powers for UT to retake their place. They may become an occasional contender, a tough out every 4-6 years, but college football has changed from what it was the last time UT was a household name.
Jones had some decent classes at Tennessee. It means it’s still possible for them to recruit high-level talent. They need a better coach than Jones who can recruit as well as Jones.
First off, tis notion that Tennessee does not have in-state talent is absurd. Middle Tennessee continues to grow, and as such, the high school talent increases every year.
Overall, this article is preposterous. A lot can change in college sports in the course of a few years. Look at what happened to Arkansas in the space of one year. To say that any program will never be competitive again is dumb.
The truth is, Tennessee will always have the ability to compete at the highest level due to its size and resources. It just needs the right leadership. Something that is severely lacking.
The issue is Tennessee as a state doesn’t have enough elite talent. It doesn’t matter how much the high school talent pool increases if there are not many difference makers.
Show me 4 or 5 four stars from there. Heck, even 1 or 2. I don’t think they exist.
According to 247 the state of Tennessee had 9 four star recruits in 2021, and has 12 for 2022. The problem is Pruitt did a poor job locking down the state. In 2014 and 2015, Butch signed 14 of the top 20 players in the state. Throw in a little Astro Dobbs, and you have the chance for a couple of special years. This year Pruitt signed 1 of the top 10 players. Tennessee is always going to pull 4 and 5 star recruits from other states, but as this article so gently points out, it’s not the late 80s/90s any longer, and UT can’t live on recruits from Cali, GA, and Florida any longer. To have a chance at being competitive, UT needs to stop the bleeding at home. They need to find a way to keep 6-8 of the top kids home every single year. I just don’t know what the selling point is. Play for the second best team in the state(behind Memphis)? Play in a large stadium that will only be half full by the time the 4th quarter starts every single time UF, UGA, or Alabama come to Knoxville? As a life long UT fan, that is painful to write but it’s true. And what’s the fix? Nobody named Stoops, Meyer, Saban, or Swinney is going to take the job. I just don’t know anymore. If I was a drinking man, this would be about the time I’d be opening up the bottle…
200 people move to Middle Tennessee every day. This equates to an increase in high school talent.
Also, historically, Tennessee is not the talent poor state that others claim it is. While it isn’t GA, FL, or TX, it is still a significant talent pool; one that continues to grow.
Lastly, Tennessee is geographicaly located to do well in recruiting. Knoxville is close to multiple states with huge talent pools.
There isn’t top level talent in Tennessee. The 2021 class has 3 players in the top 200 with the best player ranked 59th and the next player is 98th. That’s not good enough talent to build a SEC championship contender around. So they have to get elite players from other states. Having said that the 247 Sports team talent composition has Tennessee at 15. That might be good enough to compete for titles in some other conferences but it puts them 7th in the SEC.
I think the article makes several valid points, the biggest being that the NCAA violations are going to retard UT’s ability to attract a difference maker as coach. Further, over the past decade, UT has been unable to attract top recruits from FL, GA, TX, and CA. Without a coach, who can attract top talent, while competing with Saban, Smart, Mullen, Fisher, and Orgeron for that talent, there is little chance that UT will enjoy much success. I foresee the Vols being regulated to the pile of also-rans like SC, KY, and MO for the next decade at the least. It has been difficult, at best to attract top talent to UT for 2 almost decades now, the NCAA punishment that is likely headed their way will almost certainly be their death knell.
Agreed
Tennessee is capable of everything Clemson, UGA, Florida, Oregon, etc are capable of. It will take a while to get back there m, but they are capable.
No. No they’re not.
Yes. Yes they are. They have more national titles, all time wins, and conference titles than all those teams.
I believe that UT can be elite with the right coach, but all time wins means nothing. CFB made a huge change when black athletes were allowed to compete. The recruiting dynamics today aren’t even comparable to the early years of CFB
From yesteryear and they are 10 wins ahead of UGA. UT has won one national championship in the last 53 years, that was 22 years ago. They are winning them at about the same rate as AU. That is pretty good, but is not going to make you a dominant team in the conference.
Dude, you give all Dawg fans a bad rep. Dont be such a loser.
We all know the losers.
Well, we know that UGA can’t never win anything regardless of how many stars they gather, put them on the walls boys… TN might find a good coach….UGA has Kirby dumb dog…incompetent as the mascot (poor excuse for a dog)…can’t develop talent, can’t call plays…1980
UT is done for the next 8 to 10 years if not more. It will take that long to rebuild it.
You are a relic from 1980…LOL
You have won one national championship in 53 years, the same number as UGA.
Since 2008 Tennessee is the location where coach’s careers end.
That is true. For me, it’s too big for a coach’s first big job. The mistake UT keeps making is trying to find the “next great coach.”
We need to go and hire someone established; that means paying more.
UT does not have time for the “on the job training” that Pruitt, Dooley, and Butch required.
Exactly! Get a coach to build mid term and then an experienced coach. We did the same scenario after Meyer with 2 experimental and had to overhaul.
Marshgator89, so you are saying Mullet, is on the same level as Meyer… hahahah… I can’t wait for next year, Florida will end up doing the same thing UT did and Mullet already has NCAA violations… UF want even have to hire lawyers at $800hr or whatever price, bc he’s already screwed…
Marshgator89, all this talk about a squirrel finding a nut, well this year was Florida’s nut… and y’all still came out 8-4… if that was my nut, I’d find a new wife….
Bama did the same thing there for a while. Bama is not the place for OJT.
DieselNova – agree, Tennessee will have to do their NCAA jail time first. These things go in cycles.
BR – nuff said!
The article makes a good point about the 90’s. It’s slowly becoming ancient history.
I don’t think things in Knoxville are forever irreparable. UT just needs a top tier coach. Who would want to go there right now though? Not sure what’s going on with the NCAA but UT may have to suffer through a few sanctions too.
Phil Fulmer has ruined that program. Whatever good he ever did for Tennessee (1998) has been negated by his leadership as AD.
If the 90s are ancient history, then 1980 is….
LOL, agreed, these British dogs are the real delusionals. TN might win a NC in the future, UGA already lost their opportunity and chocked on their food! They are set with their mediocre coach.
Smell the Glove… agree, but Kirby is not recruiting based on the early 1980’s and believe me, that’s a good thing.
UGA has been a very good consistent program during Richt and Kirby’s years. And while the Vols were a pretty dang good in the early 2000’s – it’s been mediocre as a whole this century.
Since 2000 (Richt’s first year)
Head to head – UGA is 15-6 against Tennessee.
SEC East Titles: UGA 8 – Vols 3 (last one in 2007)
SEC Titles: UGA 3 – Vols 0
For today’s 18 year old – UGA is a top 10 if not top 5 program.
UTK will be back and win big one day. Down cycles can happen. Despite these last 10 years, UTK is a big time program that currently can’t get out of it’s own way.
Today’s 18 year olds have never witnessed UGA win a NC… They have witnessed them fall on their face every year though..
For that matter, neither have they witnessed a UT team win a national championship.
The Tennessee Football Fans are getting everything they deserve.
That’s what you people get for the way you unfairly treated Greg Schiano. It’s called, “KARMA”.
Tennessee is probably better off hiring the coach at Army so he can run the triple option. Might be the only way to start winning again.
I disagree. Tennessee needs to hire a coach who has done it before at an elite level. The last few coaches have been duds because Tennessee has tried to find the next “up and coming” coach.
what proven hc, whose won at an elite level do you see interested in the tn job? and, how much do you think tn would have to pay them to convince them to step into that mess?
this isn’t a jab. this is reality. we may have different definitions of the term “elite,” but i don’t see any elite coaches interested in wanting to work with that admininstration.
I think coaches that want massive resources and a boat load of money.
Texas has done so well. Thanks for advice.
Better than you since 1998:
Texas: 199-84
Tennessee: 168-109
You’re program sux.
“your”
“It’s not that difficult”.
Easily said by a dude sitting at keyboard who has never run an organization of any kind, much less an SEC football program.
Then go do it yourself, hot shot. I’m sure it pays a lot more than whatever SDS throws at you, if you get paid anything at all.
GA has proven it’s impossible to win big. GA has done less with more. Over and over again. Expert advice from a perennial also ran.
i kind of feel sad for you
You are on the spot. AGREED!
Georgia poopy kicker. Dude you need to get a life man. I looked at your posting history. It’s really pathetic.
The thing is vol1, even if UGA has done less with more, what we have done in the last 20 years, and especially the last five, is eons beyond what UT has done. UT had a few good years in the 90’s. Your run was over long ago. You’re living in the past. Take up bowling or something that won’t frustate you so much.
Wow, Matt Hayes is going for the kill with Tennessee.
If Tennessee can get on UGA’s schedule (1980-2020), Tennessee will be relevant again in 40 years. But still no Championship.
Go away fake SEC fan. You’re from OSU.
Wherever he’s from, he’s right.
Funny. Uga won the sec in 2002, which means TN should be in contention next year. Do you honestly think they’re anywhere near competing for the SEC championship dude?
It’s funny how the ones who always say “less with more” are the ones who are doing less than UGA. My question is always “less than who?” Less than Bama? Bama has as much and more than UGA has. UGA has more than everyone else in the east and they do MORE than everyone else in the east.
Never is a long time. What does Matt do when he’s not writing clickbait and looking like a pedo?
“You might get a one-off season every now and then where the Vols make it to the SEC Championship Game. You might strike lightning in a bottle and land a recruit everyone missed (see: Lamar Jackson), and he might be enough to win the East Division.
But this program will never again win like it did in the golden years of Phil Fulmer and Peyton Manning and Tee Martin and Al Wilson. Never.”
Correct me if I’m wrong but during those glory years Tennessee only won 1 national championship, and it was only because Houston nutts razorbacks couldn’t properly take a knee… hardly an elite program if you ask me. Definitely not on the level of a program that can say half of the active head coaches with national championships won em at their school. Still better than Georgia though… poor bulldogs.
Bleaux me. You’re program has run out of luck. LSU is heading straight for probation just like UT. Covering up sexual assualts is pathetic. They should take the NC from the criminals.
And the joke of a championship with Myles should be revoked too. What team is awarded a NC after losing to Arkansas and Kentucky? That NC was the catalyst for a playoff. Nobody wanted to see a joke of a champion like that again.
2007 might’ve been the weirdest year in football history. There were only two teams that finished with less than 2 losses: Kansas and Hawaii. And your UGA Bulldogs lost to Tennessee (ironically) which was the reason y’all didn’t play us in Atlanta. remember Kentucky had Andre Woodson (maybe the best Kentucky QB ever) who threw for 3700 yards and 40 TD’s in an SEC that was still a conference about defense and physical tough football. Arkansas had Darren McFadden who finished second in the Heisman voting to Tebow. So yea those losses weren’t great and I agree that the BCS was flawed but 2007 was weird and we ended up beating 7 ranked opponents at the time of the game (VT, SC, UF, Auburn, Bama, UT, and OSU).
that year was a great ride those last couple of weeks. i really wish we could have seen a lsu v uga match-up in the sec champ with the winner going to the bcs champ. many agreed that uga was playing the best ball at the end of the year. but, uga tripped-up during the reg season and missed out. lsu was the rightful champ
4 coaches have NCs right? Technically Jimbo won one at LSU too so that’s 3 of the 4
There’s 5. I think you’re forgetting Mack Brown
Actually, there are 6: Saban, Dabo, Jimbo, Ed O, Les and Mack
Dang so 4 of 6 NC winning HCs have won one at LSU? Pretty impressive.
Les Myles doesn’t count. He lost to Arkansas and Kentucky that year.
Help me out here; when was Jimbo Fisher the head coach of LSU and when did he win a Natty? Being an assistant or a co-ordinator doesn’t count or we’ll also need to give credit to the others coaches, equipment managers, recruiting staff, etc.
Probably should wait for the results about the investigation into Coach O mishandling sexual assault charges before acting too high and mighty. That could potentially crater LSU and set it back a decade or two. Also, how’d all those predictions about repeat Heismans and NCs go? You sure did seem just so confident for a team that opened up with a loss to MSU and followed it up to blowout losses to Missouri and Auburn.
Myles Brennan will still win a Heisman and natty to prove my predictions correct… watch and see.
I respect your consistency.
What are the Vegas odds on either one of those? I doubt they would even offer odds on those it’s such a massive long shot.
Interestingly Max Johnson has better odds than Myles Brennan to win the Heisman right now… and both of em have better odds than LSU to win the natty… my my Vegas is aloof.
Yeah so what are the odds? 500 to 1? Put your money where your mouth is. You run your mouth here so much it’s going to waste so put it all down on Brennan. I’m putting my money on Coach O gone by season end of 2022.
Ah bs.. Tennessee could be elite again someday ..I’d put them in the top 10 of college football programs of all time..what ever happened to giving a coach 5 years to build his program?.. this was Pruitts first head coaching job.. not sure he ever got the chance to learn from the mistakes he made & improve as coach from them.. Tennessee fired Butch Jones who had a overall winning record .. had they been patient & kept jones no telling how much stability would have helped build the program back up.. & yes right now it’s Saban,Dabo & Meyer as the elite coaches but one day it will be another group of coaches that’s elite & I got news for all y’all people living in a southern state like myself.. theirs f**king hillbilly’s in every state..
I think the comparison with Nebraska is a fair one. I’d put Nebraska in the top 10 programs of all time, too, but they’re not going to be sniffing the CFP anytime soon. Not even a NY6 for the Huskers.
The Vols were in the same boat even before the upcoming sanctions. After? They might be within seeing distance of the Gators and Dawgs by the time kids born in ’98 turn 30.
Might. But I doubt it.
Nobody has more charisma than O… and he annually recruits top 5 classes… he will be the highest paid coach in the land soon enough… write that down.
He’ll be fired for NCAA violations and possibly criminally charged.
Fantasyfootballgod. That would be something! Kind of like a fantasy…
I’d say any of the coaches that recruit better than Coach O are more charismatic. And you’ll have to excuse me for not writing down any of your asinine predictions.
it’s good that you like your hc. i think you’ll be hard-pressed however to find many outside of that fanbase that’s willing to bet on him getting back to the sec champ, let alone another nat’l champ
“Lane Kiffin – he wasn’t ready, and he absolutely was leaving should the USC job open up (of course it was opening up; the Trojans were staring at the NCAA sheriff)”.
I have always believed that Kiffin came to Tennessee to essentially get some HC experience, and then to go back to USC the next year, if they couldn’t weasel their way out of serious NCAA trouble.
I think the article nailed the issues of Mullen and Florida’s relationship troubles. 2021 will be a very interesting year in Gainesville. I wonder if Mullen will be able to keep his mouth shut for that long?
It’s going to be hard for Tennessee to find a top flight coach, who wants to plug all the holes in that sinking ship. But I hope they find a coach who can get them to playing better. The SEC is better when UT is fielding a competitive team.
Saban would come to UT for 20 mil a year. Coaches can be bought just like anyone else.
No lmao
No, that’s not how things work in the real world. Saban wouldn’t want to tarnish his reputation and record by slogging through the necessary tough years just to get Tennessee back on the footing to compete.
At this point in his career, Saban would have them in the hunt by year 2. He took over a 6 win Bama program and won 12 games in year 2 and a national title in year 3. He’s at a point now where he doesn’t even have to put any effort into recruiting, kids just want to play for him no matter what.
You might have had a shot at Saban 7-8 years ago with the right money but he’s too established in Tuscaloosa/Birmingham (part owner of a Mercedes dealership in Birmingham, children and grandchildren live there, too) as well as too old (he will turn 70 during the next season) to start over somewhere else, especially with the mess that Tennessee is in.
You need to go to rehab and get off the drugs.
Really? The guy probably drives a 10 year old car. He probably doesn’t give a poisoned rats a$$ about money at this point. He’s made enough to take care of his children, grand children and their children. He can’t be bought by UT at this point. So why would he go to UT? He has no ties to the program other than enjoying kicking their a$$ year after year.
The SEC East needs Tennessee to be competitive. It benefits the entire conference. Now Georgia & Florida are the SEC East.
A program with a top 10 fan base will never be elite again? That’s pretty bold Matt.. good writing :) lol
SMDH, WRONG! If Tenn would have won SECCG in ’01 they would have gotten their teeth kicked in by Miami NOT Nebraska..C’MON MAN!
Mistakes are excused, but when it pertains to probably the most talented team EVER..notsomuch.
Depends on how you define elite, but Tennessee is definitely a sleeping giant. They’ll be back. And oh btw so will LSU.
Agreed. It will be a big hump to get over but I think the Vols will get it together eventually.
Has LSU gone away? Lol, you just won it all in 19!
Agree – LSU and UTK will both be back. I could see LSU top 10 next year depending on the TAMU game.
Here’s the truth that hurts…Matt Hayes is such s pedestrian, hack of a “writer” that he has to resort to hit pieces on rival schools—Gainesville Homey—to get a little attention.
What’s disgusting is that SDS has lowered the bar to such a degree that they’ll let someone who couldn’t get a job with the National Enquirer submit anything on their site.
Must be getting hard up for readers publishing such click-bait.
I’m not wanting to sound like an ass but do you guys not proof read what you post?
I’m going to say it. For now UK has passed UT in football, at least for the foreseeable future. We’ve had much more stability since Stoops was hired, 37-26 since 2016 compared to UT who has had 2 coaches and are 30-32.
Recruiting rankings, UT has the edge but we’ve been able to develop players much better and find hidden gems more often. You do hold the overall star lead however to your credit.
You haven’t necessarily dominated us on the field since 2016 being decided in the 4th qtr, aside from 2 being 2018 and 2020.
I’m not saying we’re elite ourselves, we have to beat you consistently and find away to be competitive with UGA more constantly before I personally would make that leap but UT is where we were comparatively in 2013, lost without a direction. Stoops gave our program stability above all and pride in our program.
You have pride, in some ways unfounded the last 20yrs, but you haven’t had stability in 14 yrs.
UKs program is very much a rebirthed one in the SEC, we aren’t great yet but we’re good and have solidly passed USC, Mizzou, and of course Vandy. Same thing with USC until you know where you are at you won’t get back to where you want to be.
UK is your main competition now, you aren’t on the same level as UF and UGA any more. If you don’t do something UK will beat you next year and constantly do so for years after if you don’t find your Stoops.
Excuse the long post, also some grammatical errors. I don’t see them as well as I would on my laptop so if it hurts your eyes to read, I apologize.
Congratulations on being 6th instead of 7th in the East.
And the minute Tennessee hires a competent coach—still not holding my breath—we’ll be back to stomping UK on a yearly basis.
Stick to basketb…never mind.
So any time any one puts criticism on your school you’re just going to throw random jabs at them? UGA: “1980”, UF random name calling (I hate UF too so I don’t mind that), even heard some UT fans moch bama. As long as you keep pretending that you’re heads and heels better than UK the more you’ll be passed up by them. Our faculties are better if not on par with yours, better development (turning 3 starts into 4 stars compared to 4 into 3). I gave y’all credit and you just say “stick to basketball”. God forbid you have some humility about where you’re program is at. It’s better for the SEC if you are good and even better if the northern most school is stealing layers away from the big 10 beating everyone outside of conference.
I’ll stick to basketball the day UT wins a national title or beats bama or UGA or UF again. Our state has better HS players over the past few years and we can actually lock down our in state talent. God bless you and your family, only he can make you see through your excuses.
*players and probably a bunch of other grammatical mistakes like a missing paragraph break. My bad!
Yeah, like “faculties” I think you mean facilities. “Moch” I think you meant mock.
Yeah, was typing that early in the morning and wasn’t really into proofreading it. I’m educated I swear just not in English or writing
Matt, we’ve found one of the ‘raucous and thin-skinned fan base’.
“Stick to basketb…never mind.”
Funny :-) But in all seriousness, UT has all the money in the world to do what they want. The problem is the attitude and approach. If the Vols want to truly be relevant again, The Big Orange Club need to take the Red Elephant Club method to heart. After missing on Rodriguez, the Club decided no one else would do other than Saban. That was it…no Plan B… Open the bags and do WHATEVER it took financially to get him there. I remember when the contract terms were disclosed…I was like WTF??? Today we don’t even blink at contract terms like that if there are results on the field. UT needs to find the very best coach in the country (available or not) that fits their program and just effin get the SOB. Just do it! No more excuses! If you’re one of the big boys, play like one. Cheers my friends!
Wow. Kentucky becomes irrelevant in basketball and the football nuts come out. Kentucky is Kentucky. It’s had a couple of good seasons in last 50 years. It’s glory days are two wins over Tennessee. In last 56 years, Ken has won 8 times and only twice in last four years. That’s laughable. Even a blind hog finds an acorn now and then.
yeah I have to agree this is a dumb take from a UK fan. Im going to attribute it to an excited fan who is happy to finally have a chance to kick down at UT. Waddlethewildcat is correct though that major steps have been taken at UK to make our facilities on par with most in the conference, and stoops has certainly done a fine job in recruiting ane elevating the program. I think Stoops is already getting plenty enough praise for that. That being said, we are still YEARS away from being on par with UT as a program. its not even close when you compare the two historically. One thing that I think Waddle does state correctly though, is that UT needs to be aware of where they are in the east right now, in 2021. While UGA and UF are certainly who UT would like to compete with, first they need establish themselves as the legitimate third best team for a few years in order to stave off a few programs that are pushing to compete with them like UK, and Mizzou (we will see what beamer can do at SC). For UT, they need to think of these teams as a rebellion that they need to squash before gearing up to take on UF and UGA. That needs to be the immediate goal that you can build on later. So dont chase a guy out for going 7-5/8-4 a couple times.
but to clarify, I hope yall stay down forever lol. ;)
I think you hit the point I was trying to make, they need to be realistic. I was making slot of what I was saying in comparison, certainly wasn’t saying the programs are comparable in terms of history. I was more so referencing the last few years, we have been better the past few years and in the modern era that’s what matters. I don’t think, understanding from a point or perspective, anything I said was delusional or unrealistic.
As a UGA fan, I certainly respect what UK has done on the gridiron. Hard hitting and well coached. A team you better focus on. Repped the SEC well in the Gator Bowl.
See below, I’m not saying our history the past 50yrs is comparable, I’m saying the past few years since 2016. We have been better, while you’ve beaten us more, we’re more stable and more consistent being able to bounce back. All I was hoping you would see is that perspective is important and you not a solid member of the big 3 any more in the East with UK challenging you and probably more wins coming for us. Again I’m not saying our program, in history, is better. I’m saying that we are on the same playing field now and for many recruits, that’s what matters.
There’s a comment below meant for you. The set up of this website is frustrating. I’ll sum it up, I’m not saying our program in terms of history is better, in the here and now we are enjoying a better win loss ratio than you and similar wins and losses to UF and UGA. You’re not head and heals better than us RIGHT NOW, and projections are that won’t change unless you get your version of Stoops. Noting delusional about what I was saying.
Vol1 & Volman = raucous and thin-skinned fan base
Ok you UK guys, could you take it a little easy on the Vols as they are in mourning again. You have to realize beating UK was their last claim to fame and that is coming to past. Beating Bama, Ga and Florida is way in the past and they are losing more than they are winning even against Vandy.
Okay, okay… I’ll try to be nice, but Vol1 & Volman are part of the ‘thin-skinned fan base’. BTW, did you notice all the surrender cobra poses in Neyland Stadium during Jamin Davis’ pick-six.
Per Bill Parcells: “you are what your record says you are”. If you want to see your future just look at your last 10 years. Unless lightening strikes UT is facing bad to mediocre football for 5 more years. That means you are one full generation from being relevant in the SEC. The trend is not your friend if you are sitting in Knoxville right now.
It’s all about players. Some teams, like GA, have top tier blue chippers but can’t win big games. Then there is Bama, Clemson, and Ohio State, who all have over 80% blue chippers too. The next tier is 60-80% with FL and LSU etc. Then 40-60 with UT etc. UT has recruited well since Fulmer, but not well enough to win SEC (nobody has except Bama). They are middle tier, and the record shows it. Of course they can recruit good players; they already do. Fulmer pioneered recruiting all over the country when UT had the biggest budget of any school. No school has been any good since Bama took over the SEC. Look at the records. Sure, FL has won. GA can’t win big games. This is all about piling on UT while it’s down, which is always a classy move. No, Schiano shouldn’t have come to UT. Meyers didn’t even promote him to interim coach when he had to sit out a few games. Schiano knew or should have known about child molesting at Penn St. Time will tell what happens. But UT has facilities and money in the top 5 and will be fine. I’ve followed Vols for 50 years and it’s always up and down, even in good seasons. The year Vols won natty, they could have easily lost a couple of games, but the ball bounced our way. It will again. It always does.
UGA is living rent free in your head. Almost every comment you’ve posted on this article mentions UGA. You’re the precise type of fan this article was meant for.
Can’t win big games? I guess the Vols are not a big game! Maybe can’t beat Bama is more like it … but that’s very hard to do for any team. …and by the way, a great debate. Which team was better – LSU 2019 or Bama 2020. My gosh, both just incredible teams. Maybe one day that Natty will come to Athens!
Since Saban came to Bama, 3 other teams/coaches have won national championships. None are at UT. The culture is toxic and UT is not going to even be competitive until that changes.
There are a lot of pro prospects on UGAs roster better than Nolan Smith. He was a high school stud but he looks to small for this level. He’s not big enough to be an edge and he’s not skilled enough in space to be a true OLB. He’s gonna need a huge season to be top pick. Dean, Davis, Pickens, Daniels, Anderson, Walker, will all be higher on draft boards.
I think you’re a bit unfair to Nolan. There was depth at his position, and as you mentioned he is a little small to where he can out physical everyone else like he did in HS. So it’s hard for him to learn at game speed because he’s not getting the reps to develop into that skilled player.
I think this article is right – I think he is poised to have a big year if he can be on the field consistently.
All I can do is say where I see him now after what I’ve seen on the field. You could be right and he could get a lot better with increased reps, but if that’s the case, is that really what a pro team wants to spend a first rounder on? I stand by the other names I gave being better pro prospects at this time
I don’t disagree with the sentiment that they’re better pro prospects. I’m not even disagreeing with you saying that he’s going to need a huge season. I just think your assessment is unfair with his limited reps. He may not have made much highlight impacts i.e. sacks, TFL, but he was constantly in QB’s faces (17 hurries). He was constantly a run deterrent when he was on the field. I was impressed with him and wondering why he can’t get more reps…then Azeez, or Anderson, would get the runner behind the line, or get the qb on the ground next play and I’ll remember that’s why.
That’s fair. I’ll disagree about being a run deterrent. He’s a specific type of run deterrent. But he struggles as an edge with the read option and with QB contain. And yes, reps could help with that. I’m not trying to say he’s a bust or a bum, but he’s left some to be desired.
That’s fair, I’ll give you that. Good chat though as usual.
“the most relentless, raucous and thin-skinned fan base”
Sorry, Tenn comes up short there. The other orange clad sillies take that one. You know, that community collage in Austin. Sorry Tenn, I am not trying to take anything away from you.
I’ve been to hundreds of UT games at Neyland. Fans are not obnoxious. Worst I ever saw were Notre Dame fans.
A silly comment from a fan whose team has only been to Neyland stadium once.. How would you know anything about TN’s fanbase. We were right about Schiano. No one seems to be talking about how bad Schiano’s team has been this year and prior. A record like that in the big ten would nearly be winless in the SEC.
You seem to take offense that someone is saying that a comment meant to demean your fan base says it isn’t true. Maybe the author is right about the “thin-skinned” part
I’m a little late to this piece, but the comments sure seem to reinforce Matt’s “thin-skinned” comment. And rather than addressing the very valid points he raises, we read more vitriol and blue-sky “All it will take is . . .” commentary. As if the past 22 years didn’t really happen – literally, a full generation of SEC futility – and can be brushed away with a few simple steps based on reputation.
I’m not surprised, though. I posted some of these same points last week and was roasted by the Vols on this site. Faith is a helluva motivator, but those orange glasses many UT fans filter the world through can also be a handicap.
And I still can’t believe the UT administration publicly served up a potential loss-of-institutional-control charge to the NCAA on a silver platter. Of all the Three Stooges-esque antics that have graced the past dozen years in Knoxville, this has got to be the dumbest. Did you learn nothing from Mizzou? Did that not teach you that the NCAA is still smarting from NC and Miami laughing in their faces, and that they’re eagerly looking for targets to take their frustration out on? Un-freaking-believable.
GA needs to take care of GA. No natty in 40 years. Smart is no better than Richt. Win something then tell us all about it.
How about Tennessee consistently wins 8 games per season to justify your unfounded cockiness first.
UT might have gotten 5 wins this year with a true non-con slate, if they scheduled the right cupcakes. Granting 8 is pretty generous!
vol1, your lack of judgement of coaching talent leads me to believe you must be on the UT Head Coach Decision committee. Clueless.
I know a lot of people who thought this was a bad move for Pruitt. I disagreed. I was wrong.
Finebaum talked about how Pruitt wouldn’t take any advice, especially with media. Bad grammar etc. Wanted to do it his way. I’ve heard talk that he was hard to get along with at other places, too. Anyone know anything?
He was great at Bama. Solid defenses under his watch.
Some guys are better coordinators than head coaches
Yep.
Pruitt improved out defense at UGA. No doubt, a very good D- coordinator.
Fulmer was fired in 2008. Even Bama’s success is cyclical. All schools go up and down. Bama only has an overall win percentage of 73%. Tennessee all time is 67%. Even great schools lose a lot of games.
BTW GA is 66%
You are literally proving Matt’s point about being a thin skinned fan base. You don’t have to reply to EVERY comment you don’t agree with.
History only has meaning in the heads of CFB fans. Tennessee’s future has nothing to do with its historical win percentage. And evening looking to such statistics to justify your conclusion that Tennessee is a “great” program is exactly what this article is about.
And for the UGa fans that are crowing, do they really believe that Pruitt started cheating once he got to UT? My guess is the dogs will be the next school hit by ncaa investigation.
From the East, Florida was the first this season to be hit with NCAA violations. Think Mullen can prevent another round of violations?
Since you asked, Yes I do think he can or Mullen will be gone, as fast as you pushed CMR out the door at UGA!!
If what they are saying about UGA is true you might be next. BTW most of the sanctions again UF are already over.
UGA next? Do you remember the school that offered newtown $180K….only to get turned down. you get one guess who was the hc at that school at the time.
you don’t think that stricklin has one eye on a potential replacement? mullen has been successful, but this past year was hardly a good year for his relationship w/ the uf admin
All great ADs should have a list of candidates to replace their football coach. Coaches are not like fans, they have no reason except money to be loyal to a school.
P, UF has already handled the situation. CDM is fine. Only time will tell but Mullen is where he wants to be and is doing what is needed.
Sparky, I agree with you’re post in general. However, SOS was the exception
Calm down, Sparky! LOL! You are probably right about UGA next up. However, we appreciate UF and UTK buying us time from the NCAA to bury the bodies!
Where there’s smoke there’s fire. Time will tell.
Don’t look for any friends in Knoxville, Tusc, Auburn, Baton Rouge or Gainesville to pour water on you if you catch on fire though!
Two things that show Matt Hayes knows very little about Texas Aggie football.
1. Bobby Brown declared for the draft so he would have the money to get his mother the best medical care available.
2, There are 8 to 10 guys more likely to be drafted in 2022 NFL draft than Luke Matthews (will be a RS Junior this season and has limited playing time).
Perhaps he was thinking Kenyon Green, but that’s a pretty bad miss.
At least the uniforms are the appropriate color for when they have to go to NCAA jail…..
I’m old enough to remember UF and UGA in the mid 80s- early 90s. This is just a rough patch.
You did make one good point about recruiting, and unfortunately it’s a byproduct of the Playoff system. As long as you only have 5 maybe 6 teams who are legitimate playoff contenders then a vast majority (not all but a vast majority) of the top recruits are not going to look or consider any school other than those top 5 or 6. The Playoffs drive recruiting more than coaches do these days so yeah, the Nebraska’s, Tennessee, FSU’s ect are feeling the effects. Expand the playoffs so the better players have more choices and more schools have a better chance to land them.
Been a fan since the mid 60’s. And Tenn aint never been elite. I understand General Neyland but who cares? That was then
Is it true : Smokey just entered the Transfer Portal?
Naw, Smokey left because his McDonalds bag had zero bones in it.
I read the posts from the Tenn fans here. I invite you to step back and review what they are saying. A few get it, and get what the writer was trying to convey. Most though play into exactly what the writer described though.
Face the facts Tenn fans… Tenn is not elite, and have been mostly irrelevant since ’98. It took a lot of bad decisions to get to this point, and adding bad decisions on top of those doesn’t make it better. Time to realize your program has a lot of work to do to become relevant again.
The SEC needs Tenn to be strong. Admit it to yourself there is a wide chasm between Tenn and the elite teams. Work to overcome it, and accept it most likely take years to right the ship especially with likely NCAA penalties. Only then will Tenn re-take its place where it belongs.
90Dawg. What if I told you all it takes to be elite in the SEC today is a fantastic passing QB, three talented experienced receivers, one average to good running back and a D that ranks in the top 70? If not than darn close. I give you LSU 19 and Bama 20 could throw in UF also. All three had very average D’s but outstanding and quite possibly prolific passing. So when writers like this write nonsense I refer them to how few additives it takes, for the right ones to win big. If Ole Miss had a D this year that was good, Bama 2020 would not have happened..Coaches at UT have failed to see this new formula for success. They refuse to believe its that simple. TN has the talent and players, just no coach believes in this formula like Saban, Kiffin, coach O and Mullen. Its starting to click with Smart at UGA. Becoming elite, isn’t as hard as it used to be.
Ole Miss was a stone throws away from a Natty this year? I must have missed something.
Bama led the SEC in scoring defense and played a tougher schedule than any SEC team.
The writer makes a few valid points, BUT he totally misses the big picture – $MONEY!
UT needs to modernize its thinking, but all the essential elements for success are there. It’s disingenuous to promote facilities, huge fan base and a history of success do not matter. Tennessee is a large state with enormous financial resources. If the school secures leadership to effectively merge all those components, success will come. Even Butch Jones won nine games back to back in 2015-2016.
Prior to Nick Saban, this same story could have been written about Alabama. We all know how that turned out, so I would caution anyone thinking the Vols will NEVER be relevant again.
You give money to stupid people, it goes to stupid places. Money doesn’t fix stupid.
well said
Does anybody here remember the shape Alabama was in before Saban showed up? They were fixing to spiral out of control. If Brees goes to the Dolphins instead of Culpepper, Saban would still be in the NFL and Alabama would potentially be the punching bag of the SEC. It is difficult to get top tier talent to come coach in the SEC. Especially somewhere like Tennessee where every year you go up against 3-5 top 15 teams. You’re signing up for a yearly beat down from some of the top teams in the country until you can get it in order. I don’t expect TN stock to rise until Alabama’s is on the way down. Which will be after Saban retires. That is the stepping stone for TN.
Not to flame, but in the 23 years since Bryant retired, Bama won 3 SEC championships, and one national championship. Also every coach they had, had a 10 win season. Bama also had a better, more high profile history and tradition. It was also a different time.
The article is a bit hyperbolic saying Tenn will never be elite again. I don’t think as long as Dabo, Kirby, and Saban are coaching they will get the same elite talents from the south east like they used to, but they can be elite. All it takes is one generational coach, one run, and you can start competing for recruits in the hotbeds.
I do think it’s weird how reactive Tenn fans are. The program is a mess, y’all can see that right? Y’all can accept that and not lash out at other programs.
I don’t know what they can do for the next couple years besides win with what they have, but a culture change is definitely in order. Not just on the field/in the locker room, but through the administration.
Sad to see all the UT hate in the comments. SEC is better when UT is good. The are the only team that has to play Fla, UGA, and Bama every year. Tough sleddin’. Hopefully the right coach will get them going. Bama was “unfixable” too in 2006.
Any team can be elite by winning games, by way of moving to being an independent or a weaker conference. It’s all about what conference your in and how many wins you get. A junk article imo written by a millennial like mind. The definition of elite is all about the conference you are in. Real elite teams win the SEC. Good teams are the ones that get blown out by them in the playoffs and apparently, we can analyze the future and whine about how teams will never be elite again. How many articles have we seen like this throughout football history with teams that eventually were elite again? Many. Yep, Bama 06 “glory days over for Bama?”.. lol Wrong.
Re: tjhillis…. Great comment! Tennessee is a blueblood. It benefits the conference when they are good…huge following; great for bowl games and conference exposure. A real UT fan would never accept mediocre even if they’ve been mediocre for years. It’s still unacceptable. And to all the UGA/FL fans, wouldn’t it be better to beat a good UT team? I’m glad Ole Miss competes in the West…it makes the wins sweeter and and loses for acceptable because the division is the best in the whole effin country. So, I understand the UT fans and agree 100%. There’s no excuse to be considered an “average” programs when nothing in their proud history suggests such an impression. Wandering aimlessly through the wilderness for 15 years doesn’t mean you won’t find a clearing one day. But wandering in a circle of failure ensures failure. So, what’s it going to be UT? Step up/pay up/man up…or… shut up.
Why this writer of this article is wrong. One, any school can be elite with the right coaching. “TN never has the players”. Really? An offense line going into last year was good enough by talent and experience to knock Bama around. Only Bama had a comparable line. Those are 5 stars not three sir. But if you don’t have the right coach and listen to boosters on who to hire, even 5 stars can regress. How about addressing the real issue at TN. Haslam. No damage was more costly than listening to a booster with a proven track record of losing. Just ask the Browns. Also, TN could move to a handful of other conferences and be elite next year. Its all about where you are and who your coaches are. Elite teams aren’t common. News flash! Maybe 4 teams a year are elite, maybe. Out of how many teams playing ball? So if your under 35 and impatient, and think elitism only comes from good players with no other intangibles, your young and wrong. One good coach with a smart administration up the chain means everything.
Wow! Never? As in never ever?
Well, while you’re at it, can you pass along the lottery numbers for the coming weeks and let me know what stocks to invest in for the rest of time?
Agree, Andy. This piece is garbage.
Much of what they publish here is just click bait.
Now that we are a communist nation, maybe we should be a little more supportive of our fellow comrades.
Watch it man. You’ll lose your twitter privileges.
Put yourself in a Vol fans shoes. We all care so much, events like this hurt. Weve all been there: losing I mean. Uga and LSU in the 90s, Bama between Bryant and Saben (except for Stallings) . Fla for 100 years until EG showed up. Auburn off and on. I feel badly for my Vol friends.
Don’t forget about the Morris Era lol
I feel awful
Tennessee should be looking at how Ole Miss handled Freeze. They need a Matt Luke type that is OK with being the transition guy to the next HC. They need someone that will bring respectability back to the program before they can think about playing winning football again. The Tennessee fan base and boosters need to find reasonable expectations for their program. This is not going to be a quick fix. I think they should bite the bullet and go with Steele for the next 2-3 years. It gets the program back to normal business and lets the new AD hire his guy after Tennessee serves whatever punishment comes down from the NCAA. The last thing Tennessee needs right now is a replay of the last coaching search.
Huh. So you want to hire Derrick Dooley again. Well, its your school, not mine.
Only idiots and children speak in absolutes. This is the kind of short-sighted drivel that everyone has come to expect from SDS. The whole world knows we’re closer to the bottom than we are the top, but to say we’ll “never be elite again” is laughable. I don’t pretend to know if it will take 5, 10, or 20+ years to get there, but it will happen when the right people are in charge. It’s happened everywhere else at some point in time, and TN is no exception to the concept of inevitability.
when were you ever elite?
After reading the first half of this article I realized how much hogwash it was. To follow the logic would mean that no team would ever be able to break out and return or even climb for the first time into an elite status. It should first be noted that there are very few dynasty type teams. Alabama, Ohio State, and Oklahoma are the current front runners. Most other teams have had limited success here and there.
Alabama had a period of mediocrity in the late 90’s until the Saban hire in 2007 before climbing back to elite status. LSU, Florida, Auburn, and Georgia have all been up and down over the years. It does not prevent them from building a great team and returning to greatness.
Tennessee can do the same. It just takes the right combination of ingredients. Unfortunately those ingredients can often be difficult to obtain. Good coaches evolve over the years. Tennessee will have to find a coach who can evolve and has the smarts to surround himself with good staff. No one expects miracles right away, but Tennessee has always recruited well, they just need development help. They will return to greatness at some point with all of the talent in Tennessee.
That’s pretty harsh. College football will be around forever and Tennessee could very well be elite again.
Never is a long time, so to say they will never be elite is a stretch. However, with the programs that are already elite in the SEC, the task will be much greater. The university has done a great disservice to the football program over the last several years with the constant turnover of coaches. Good luck UT in your efforts to find the coach to right the ship.
Who is going to want to get into that UT mess? No “elite” head coach. As for all-time wins, it does go away. Vandy led the league in all-time wins up until the 1960s. I think UT can come back as power but it will take a while, maybe 30 or 40 years and other SEC programs will need to experience a decline for that to happen.
This piece is needlessly inflammatory. Typical Bleacher Report hyperventilating.
Any program can be turned around.
The rubber has finally met the road for the likes of UT, Michigan, Nebraska, Arkansas, UCLA, and many other schools with proud football traditions. The really special talent has been gravitating to a smaller and smaller number of schools over the past 10 years or so and that number has shrunk even more over the past few years. The hype machine churns it out for the select few 24/7. Tune in to ESPN or listen/read national sportswriters and podcasts-they can’t possibly get anymore centric-team driven than they are now. Schools like UT now get noticed when a coach gets canned, hired or something bad happens, after that it’s pretty darn quiet. Sure, UT has botched it with its hiring and firing but it’s a lot more than that, just look at all the schools stuck in the same, dreary place.
Matt, with all due respect (you don’t deserve much) you’re a fool. Enjoy kicking us while we’re down. But make no mistake we have the $, facilities, huge fanbase and tradition that very, very few schools have.
You act like there are only 3 good coaches and there will never be more. Ok Einstein tell me how may 10 win seasons did Saban have at Michigan State? The prevailing opinion when LSU hired him was head scratching. But it was a huge get for the Tigers. We have flubbed up more than just about any school out there (primarily due to poor AD’s) but to say never again? Very, very foolish statement.
There you got click bait from me.
When was Tennessee elite? They had a good run when the powers in the SEC had their own turmoil. Consistent success through decades would be elite.
Agree
Exactly
Tenn has never been elite in my lifetime. And im no spring chicken.
Really? So you’ve never seen UGA win a NC either have you?
I would say winning a NC can be considered an elite team.. I would say Clemson is elite right now but they haven’t had success through decades….
If that’s the criteria I’m not sure anyone is elite really..
A similar article could have been written about Bama before Saban. Truth is UT has the money to be elite. They just need to find a good coach and AD to turn it into something.
I don’t think this is a kick them while they’re down approach. The desired culture at UT has been broken for some time, from top to bottom. Admin, coaches and fans are not on the same page and not living in reality. The Schiano debacle was the last straw, making UT thoroughly toxic to any potential quality individuals able to turn things around. It’s why they ended up with Pruitt.
It kinda boils down to self worth. I don’t believe the people making the decisions are evaluating their realistic self worth and it’s lead to poor hiring decisions and misery for their fans. And I disagree with people saying UT is Nebraska. If UT is any other blue blood in comparison it’s Michigan. Once that Ohio pipeline got shutdown it suffocated their program. Same with UT and Georgia. Richt started it and Smart continued it.
I wonder if Peyton would be interested in hiring on for say a QB coach instead of just a coach search. That would sure be a light for them. Even as an analyst. I dont know, but maybe its time for him to lend a hand for a few years on staff.
It certainly wouldn’t hurt. His reputation alone would attract QB recruits.
I willingly admit I’m a Buckeye homer but I really believe the guy who can bring what UT needs is a guy like Luke Fickell. He’s experienced turmoil as an interim coach after the Tressel debacle and is now winning with 2 and 3 star kids at UC. Although they did lose to UGA they played well. Need a guy with great principles, work ethic, culture changer and whose players love playing for him.
He makes way too much money NOT to coach to put himself in such a risky situation. I also don’t think he would be willing to succumb himself to a higher coaching authority after his NFL days.
I just dont believe for a minute that this is a reasonable forecast. I dont believe Freeze cant be hired. I do believe that Napier would jump at the job and not just for the money. And there are some good recruits I know for a fact in the Memphis area. Whether they can become SEC quality I dont know. Fickell I think would still wait for the Michigan job so you cant call on him. But the Vols will be back some day. A good start would be to retire Fulmer. I just dont think many want to work with him. A trust issue.
I don’t believe Fick would ever go to UM. His situation at UC is far better than what UM could provide. He essentially told MSU no thanks and that’s a better place now than UM. UM is a dumpster fire, essentially in similar situation that UT got themselves in with Fulmer, Lloyd Carr still has influence behind the scenes. Just toxic.
It’s not impossible for UT to be elite again, but their biggest problem is the delusion that elite is an appropriate short-term goal. They always think they’re one season away from a national championship – which leads them to instant gratification decision-making (with predictable results).
They have a strong base of boosters with wealth and political clout, but that can be a curse rather than an asset when those genius boosters think they’re just ten minutes away from another 1998 and all they need to do is (insert idiotic impulse decision here).
Forget about 1998. For the moment, forget about trying to be a perennial top 5 program and just focus on trying to be a perennial top 15 program.
The gap between top 15 and top 5, really good versus elite, is huge. You’re not going to jump straight from borderline mediocre to elite in one season. You need to hire a solid coach who will put in a strong sustained effort for the next 5-10 years. Building a sensible rather than toxic culture.
And for gosh sakes, don’t turn around and fire the guy because you’re disappointed with a ten win season.
Tennessee is not finished now any more than Auburn in 1980. They still have a brand just like Nebraska, tarnished yes but still there. Tennessee will return to prominence. As to coaches it begins and ends with Hugh Freeze. The war on Christianity headed by the chancellor employed because of plumbing not ability, will be the chief impediment.
As a dyed-in-the-wool, multiple generation Alabama fan, I was certain that we were a fading power prior to Saban being hired. And the results have been astounding. I expected a National Championship, but six? Unbelievable.
Certainly Tennessee can rebound, though I agree it will take years. Tennessee versus Alabama hasn’t been much of a rivalry for the past decade and a half. And that’s bad for the conference. I do agree with the writer that securing elite players is crucial to building an elite program. I live in the same suburban city where Pruitt coached in high school and cringed when I saw him portrayed on the mid-2000’s MTV reality show “Two-a-Days.” Still, he seemed to do a good job as Alabama’s defensive coordinator, though I feared at first he was in over his head.
I think that Tennessee’s Knoxville location in Appalachia separates them from the Deep South SEC schools like Alabama, Auburn, Georgia, Ole Miss, Miss State, and the like. The fan base resembles the attitudes of that region of the country, just like LSU’s fan base of Cajuns separates it from the rest of the conference. The South is not one singular entity. I would also argue that Kentucky is nominally Southern, as is Texas A&M and Missouri, perhaps even Arkansas. They’re certainly not Deep South.
All that said, as the writer of this post claims, recruiting into talent-rich areas of the Southeast is crucial for UT’s success on the gridiron. What is often overlooked is that most of the state Tennessee and Memphis share vastly different cultures. Memphis in some ways is more like part of North Mississippi than West Tennessee.
Wow. No trolling just good comments. Thank you
Really sound science. Kudos.
Given all this why would UT itself publish its own sins and misdemeanors? Given its special place in the world of college football recruiting why should this institution lambaste itself so publicly and voluntarily (“pun” of whatever intended)? ???
Butch Jones is a moron. A lot of crap went south when he sold his “I might be a retard but I’m worth millions of dollars” Forest Gump butt self to them.
Next year will be our year! GO VOLS!!!
Love it when people say never. Just absolutely stupid. No, we probably won’t be a for a long time, but never? That’s just stupid.
Silly article.
The NCAA needs to burn your sorry ass program down. Handing out bags of cash in Big Mac sacks?? You’ve got to be kidding me!! Big time probations and bowl bans should be levied at Tennessee.
Stupid take. That’s like saying UF couldn’t ever be elite before Spurrier got there.
Tennessee has some idiot rich alumni who continue to think that they are smarter than the rich alumni of other SEC schools. Fact is, they are not. In fact, this is probably the biggest group of morons, miscreants and clowns ever assembled to bully a school administration into hiring their favorite bozo of the year.. Look at the last fifteen years!!! You have made the University of Florida and Georgia Programs better with your incompetence and missteps. Really, really sad. Hey boys, stick to basketball.
Tough words but pretty much right on.
I guess by this logic Tennessee should start negotiations to join the ACC.
My Gosh. I just rolled that cheap plastic wheel on my mouse from top of this thread to bottom and back to top and now that wheel has rolled under the refrigerator and my right index finger needs ibuprofen.
This is the first major college football break after Bama’s slaughtering them yankees and it is about the worst one I’ve been forced to reckon with and digest since maybe my time began.
WTF is going here, Tennessee?
I just thank GOD y’all’s state (of affairs) was infinitely less crazy, muddled, and befuddled when we Texans were needing to regain freedom from Santa Anna 166 years ago.
186
Pruitt is just doing it like Saban taught him.
Shots fired.
Saban saw how successful LSU was last year at doing it. So he decided to evolve his program.
I wouldn’t say they won’t be elite again. At the rate they are hiring coaches, the better the chance of hiring the next Dabo Swinney.
I’m a dawgs fan, but still never say never. Program could still be competitive eventually but not close now.
HAHA this is hilarious I love watching the demise of the poor vols. Even their basketball team was exposed by a UF team missing their 3 best players hahahaha.
Look, there is no reason Tennessee can’t be elite again! They have the money, the facilities, and the fanbase to do so. If all of you Vol fans will remember, Alabama went through several coaches in a short period and was a dumpster fire when Saban arrived. Heck, we fired one coach before he even coached a game! Shula’s teams were handicapped by probation and scholarship reductions, so, it is possible to rebuild from the ashes. But, you’re gonna have to break away from the mindset that you have to hire someone associated with the program! Bama did and so far so good, and, I believe that Auburn has finally made the right move as well.
Currently, Tennessee football claims six official national championships: 1938, 1940, 1950, 1951, 1967 and 1998. Some argue 1967 is not a good example as they had 2 losses that season. This is not elite. I don’t know what definition is used for elite. I guess people know it when they see it? Used to be “10 win seasons” but this seems to have changed. At this rate, the gap from 67 to 98 is going to be exceeded. Took 31 years last time. They are at 23 right now. With sanctions it will be at least 5 years more to be competitive again. There just aren’t any “elite” coaches out there available to a program like this. They need an experienced person, who can get them out of the woods.
Really, dude? I get that the Vols are in the news and you need to capitalize on the views, but, seriously? By your reasoning, every program not named Alabama, Clemson, Ohio St should just hang it up, or, at best, hope for 1 good year every 20.
Sports, are at their heart, a competition. When you compete, you compete to win or what’s the point? Vols have high hopes for their program but so should every program. If not, then I agree with you, every program should hang it up.
Every Vol fan knows we have been dysfunctional and have performed poorly for many years now, reminders are not something we need. Yes, we have a vocal fan base. Yes, all other teams do too. You read the comments section lately?
Finally, on the recruiting front, you’re just plain wrong and woefully uninformed. Have you looked at TN’s 2022 class? Have you seen the boom that has been happening for awhile in Nashville? Have you looked at a map lately? We are as close to Memphis as we are GA, NC, SC, AL, and very close with FL, MS. One of our top recruits is Texas. So no, the state is not holding us back.
So what’s the point? We need new and better leadership to take advantage of the our program. You are right that there is only one Saban, but that’s a problem every program has. Alabama was able to to hire the best coach in the history of CFB and that’s a problem every program has had to deal with. He won’t be coaching forever and their next hire will be just as important as everybody else’s.
Carol Folts equals Donde Plowman. I think “being elite” for many big time programs administrations is starting to be viewed as a liability not an asset for the school overall. An earlier poster implied the same thing. Between the impending NIL changes, concussions, and the shady recruitment dealings that go on at virtually every school, they don’t need it. I think we see another winnowing of schools and see a “super division” of 10-20 schools who are the elite. At some point between schools questioning the very reason they are in D1 football, and realizing they are just cannon fodder for the top dogs something is gonna give.
First: “what could’ve been a unique and intriguing hire (Mike Leach)” Where has Mike Leach EVER sustained a winning program? His version of the air raid has been figured out because he still refuses to run the ball, adjust to the players he has or be accountable. Compare to OU that gets the best running backs, adjusts to it’s QB’s skill set & is trying to build a defense.
Second: We need to get over “making the playoff” to judge what is good for a program. Developing a acceptable number of players for the NFL draws 4-5 stars and the Vols have the money, the facilities, all they need are the Coaches. Get to 8+ wins, get a major bowl, get to the point you can beat Georgia & Florida at home, stay on the field with Alabama, get to the SEC title game at least every 5 years. Let Ohio State, Alabama, Clemson go to playoff. Use that 1 SEC title every 5 years to win and get into the playoff. Vols play Alabama every year, so if they get there it would a second Tide game or a team good enough to beat the Tide. Get Tony Elliott from a winning culture who has developed every QB on his roster, give him 5 years and stay out of the way until Year 4 to either give him an extension for averaging 8+ wins, beating Georgia & Florida once each, NOT losing to Vandy, NOT losing at home to any non-Power 5 team, showing improvement vs. Tide or let him know the 5th year what he has to do to stay.
I find it hilarious that Georgia fans are calling UT fans delusional with a inflated value of their program. That is the epitome of the pot calling the kettle black. The SEC East is pathetically weak containing all the SEC bottom feeders, the only other team that is consistently competitive is Florida. Since Urban Meyer left in 2010, UF has been sporadic and above average at best yet you are only 6-5 in that time, going back to 2000 7-13 and under Kirby Smart you are only 3-3 against the Gators. That is very average at best. This year you lost to a South Carolina team who was blown out the very next week by a struggling LSU team. Incidentally, your record against the Gamecocks since 2010??? 6-5. So let’s look how you have matched up against the heavyweights of the west. You are 0-10 against Bama going back to 91, 0-3 under Kirby Smart. Against LSU, 4-6 since 2000, 1-4 since 2010 and 0-2 under Smart. You have had success against Auburn going 13-7 since 2000, 7-3 since 2000 and 6-1 under Smart, but the all time record is 61-56-8, hardly dominant. You call yourself a championship program yet in the SEC championship game you are 3-5 all time, 1-4 since 2010 and 1-2 under Smart. LSU has been your most frequent opponent in that game playing 4 times, your record?? 1-3. So against LSU, Alabama, Auburn, and UF Kirby Smart is 9-9, with a 6-1 record against Auburn, which makes him 3-8 against the rest, hardly a protocol son. The factual data proves you are basically a second tier team benefiting from playing the weakest teams in the conference with the division winner going to the winner of the UF game and that is a 50-50 split. Then propelled forward by the reputation of the SEC. When you step up against the true top tier teams you loose, consistently. With only 2 natty’s in school history coming in 1942 and 1980 and only playing for one more in 37 yrs in which you blew a 20 point second half lead to who? A top tier SEC team in Alabama. Plus only 3 SEC titles in 20 yrs while playing for 8, calling yourself a championship program is definitely a delusional stretch of reality. Furthermore, to think that you are somehow on the verge of winning a National Championship much less multiple natty’s when you cannot win a big game against quality opponents is not only delusional but a side splitting laughable stretch of reality and a utterly unrealistically inflated delusional since of what your program is. So you should not be throwing rocks when you live in a flimsy glass house.
The writer should have waited a few days to make his forecast on the Vols. Another self-proclaimed expert whose predictions on the future of my team have as much chance of being accurate as there is on finding election fraud in Georgia. The school made a smart choice on a new AD and if he in turn makes a wise choice in hiring a football coach, which he has done on more than one occasion at other schools, the university’s football fortunes could turn around in a hurry. All it takes at any school with tradition and resources is the right hire.
Let the hate flow through you.
Come on, man. Never is a mighty long time. The right Coach, AD, and a ton of money and anything can happen
Tennessee is precisely the kind of program that– when you say It can NEVER be great again– will use said statement toward making itself great, again.
Tennessee football will be great, again.
Change the name to LSU and write it circa 1990 or Alabama circa 2003. Any questions?
“Tennessee (insert name of any other regional powers during a low period), please stay down I need you to so that my program can succeed” is how these read every time. The only reason anyone has an urge to tell a long suffering fan base that knows all to well what the situation is within their program is because frankly you have an interest in seeing them stay where there are but it’s not your or any fan’s duty, let alone right, to tell any team to settle for mediocrity and give up. That’s ludicrous and yet it’s what this is premised on.
*they are. Ugh, why do the comments not have an edit function for typos?